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"Mariology?" You've Got to be Kidding Options · View
Yada
#41 Posted : Saturday, July 19, 2008 2:53:04 AM
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Don't know if anyone has been following the "World Youth Day 2008" being held now in Australia. Mary, of course, plays a prominent role:

Quote:
Our Lady of the Southern Cross, Help of Christians
"Do whatever He tells you!"(Jn 2:5) Feast of Mary, Help of Christians - 24 May

Mary, Help of Christians, she is mother and virgin, the perfect model for all women and also for men. She is the Patroness of Australia, under the title "Help of Christians" and the patron of the Archdiocese of Sydney whose Cathedral is called St Mary's. Under the title of 'Our Lady of the Southern Cross' she is patron of the Australian Diocese of Toowoomba and of WYD08.

It is Our Lady of the Southern Cross to whom WYD08 pilgrims are encouraged to consecrate themselves in the spirit of the motto of Pope John Paul II "Totus Tuus", I am all yours, as you make your pilgrimage to the Cathedral during the WYD08 week.

The title of 'Southern Cross' derives from the constellation of stars seen only from the southern hemisphere. Mary is the Help of Christians as she leads all people to her Son. She is our help and our advocate.

Archbishop Francis P. Carroll, then President of Australian Catholic Bishops Conference, said in 2001:

Our Lady of the Southern Cross

"We have total confidence that Mary the Mother of Jesus will be with us to pray for us and to lead us to her Son. Overshadowed and empowered by the Holy Spirit, Mary conceived and gave birth to Jesus, nurtured him as a child, sought him when lost, elicited his first miracle and stood to the end by his Cross of shame and suffering. She was with the Apostles and Disciples when the Holy Spirit came with Pentecostal power to give birth to the Church.

As she accompanied her Son in all of the significant events of his life, who could doubt that she accompanies the Church as it continues to live and grow as the Body of Christ. Not only does Mary accompany and support the Church as the first disciple of her Son, but she is also its Mother.

We must be a holy people united in love. Pope John Paul reminds us that the Church's structure is totally ordered to the holiness of Christ's members and holiness is measured according to the great mystery in which the bride responds with the gift of love to the gift of the bridegroom. Mary goes before us all in the holiness that is the Church's mystery. She goes before, as "a model of the Church in the matter of faith, charity and perfect union with Christ". The Holy Father writes: "She (Mary of Nazareth) precedes everyone on the path of holiness; in her person the Church has already reached that perfection whereby she exists 'without spot or wrinkle'. In this sense one can say that the Church is both Marian and Apostolic-Petrine".

God first entered the world through Mary, who is 'full of grace' (Luke 1:28), when Jesus was born, and Jesus performed his first public miracle at her prodding. She was centrally present when the Spirit was poured out upon the nascent Church at Pentecost, fulfilling the promise 'you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you will be my witnesses' (Acts 1:8). She teaches us how to allow God to be poured out upon the world through us, to 'magnify' Him (c.f. Luke 1:46-55), so that He can be seen, known, loved and worshipped. WYD08 pilgrims can consecrate themselves to her with John Paul II's words 'all yours', so that God may more freely transform each one of us and the world with his saving power.

Our Lady of the Southern Cross, Help of Christians - pray for us

source
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Yada
#42 Posted : Saturday, July 19, 2008 3:12:36 AM
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Apparently, the RCC has been carting this 'icon' of the "Virgin and Child" around Oceania (and the world). Below is one of the photos included on the "World Youth Day 2008." More images can be found here.
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YAH is my FATHER
#43 Posted : Saturday, July 19, 2008 11:52:23 AM
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I thought I might offer this link into this discussion regarding the significance of the RC Mary, and her place in the greater scheme of things - religiously formulated.


"So knowledge isn't the main measure, love of Yahweh and of each other is."
Yada
#44 Posted : Tuesday, July 22, 2008 8:17:03 PM
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The caption on the photo below reads:

Quote:
NUN MIGRANTS Salvador Martinez holds a hymn book for daughter Esmeralda, 3, during a prayer service at a migrant camp near Hart, Mich. The service was led by Sister Guadalupe Moreno, who has worked with Hispanics and migrant workers in Western Michigan for 17 years.
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Yada
#45 Posted : Monday, August 04, 2008 7:49:39 AM
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I just saw an interview with an American woman whose Catholic 'spiritual director' has nicknamed her "Little Mary." She claims to have been getting messages from the "Virgin Mary," many of which apparently focus on The United States.

If you're interested in reading some of these "messages," I've attached a Word documents with 64 of them. It's not hard to see how truth has been twisted and blended with this great and terrible deception.

You can also find several blogs devoted to "Little Mary" here.

Very sad indeed.
File Attachment(s):
little-mary-64-msgs.doc (190kb) downloaded 6 time(s).
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Sator
#46 Posted : Monday, August 04, 2008 12:08:57 PM
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I was looking through the doc, I see that Mary call her son Jesus , That's informative enough for me. :)

Sator

Yada
#47 Posted : Friday, August 15, 2008 8:23:01 AM
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For those of you who might have forgotten (lol):

Quote:
THE ASSUMPTION OF MARY: A BELIEF SINCE APOSTOLIC TIMES
Father Clifford Stevens

The Assumption is the oldest feast day of Our Lady, but we don't know how it first came to be celebrated.

Its origin is lost in those days when Jerusalem was restored as a sacred city, at the time of the Roman Emperor Constantine (c. 285-337). By then it had been a pagan city for two centuries, ever since Emperor Hadrian (76-138) had leveled it around the year 135 and rebuilt it as <Aelia Capitolina> in honor of Jupiter...

Read on
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bitnet
#48 Posted : Friday, August 15, 2008 9:35:54 AM
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Shabbat Shalom,

It was a dark and stormy night, and not a whisper was heard when the tooth fairy rode upon the back of the Easter Bunny to bring great tidings about the forthcoming saviour Santa Claus, without whom the merchants of the earth could not achieve prosperity to drive the economies of the world... In case you are wondering, it is the same kind of story...
The reverence of Yahweh is the beginning of Wisdom.
Yada
#49 Posted : Friday, August 15, 2008 10:33:48 AM
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Does anyone know how the Aug. 15th date got tied to this "Assumption of Mary?"
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Yah Tselem
#50 Posted : Friday, August 15, 2008 11:15:27 AM
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I looked it up and I really think no one knows where the date came from - it seems to have no significance.
Here are a couple things I found while trying to find where the date came from:

"it was not until 1950 that the Church proclaimed this teaching a dogma of the Church -- one of the essential beliefs of the Catholic faith"
"The first Church writer to speak of Mary's being taken up into heaven by God is Saint Gregory of Tours (594)."
"The dates assigned for it vary between three and fifteen years after Christ's Ascension. Two cities claim to be the place of her departure: Jerusalem and Ephesus"
"This has been an explicit belief for at least 1500 years being stated by St. Juvenal of Jerusalem (Bishop of Jerusalem) at the council of Chalcedon in 451 AD. The claim is that the feast was already celebrated in the east in that century.
However, This St. Juvenal was known by his peers as a Liar who would twist history to his advantage. (From a letter in the writings of the Early Church Fathers) In looking over all of the Canons of all the councils including the Council of Chalcedon in 451, there is not one mention or writing or acknowledgment of her assumption as shown above."

OK- i gotta go to a different thread now before this stuff makes me puke. May Yahweh shed light on anyone who happens to be celebrating it today and wonders why and so seeks the truth and may they find out it is an abomination!


bitnet
#51 Posted : Friday, August 15, 2008 11:27:29 AM
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Shabbat Shalom,

According to the Catholic Encyclopaedia:

Quote:
The fact of the Assumption

Regarding the day, year, and manner of Our Lady's death, nothing certain is known. The earliest known literary reference to the Assumption is found in the Greek work De Obitu S. Dominae. Catholic faith, however, has always derived our knowledge of the mystery from Apostolic Tradition. Epiphanius (d. 403) acknowledged that he knew nothing definite about it (Haer., lxxix, 11). The dates assigned for it vary between three and fifteen years after Christ's Ascension. Two cities claim to be the place of her departure: Jerusalem and Ephesus. Common consent favours Jerusalem, where her tomb is shown; but some argue in favour of Ephesus. The first six centuries did not know of the tomb of Mary at Jerusalem.


Read on for more information about a feast that is not mentioned at all in Scripture but celebrated because some men think it proper and suitable to celebrate the "mother of god" according to various dates depending upon their denomination and religious culture.
The reverence of Yahweh is the beginning of Wisdom.
Yada
#52 Posted : Saturday, August 16, 2008 4:40:53 AM
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I found this on Wikidpedia. Check out the part I underlined - a bit of flawed reasoning?

Quote:
Pope John Paul II's strong Marian devotion was highly influenced by the Mariology of Saint Louis de Montfort. According to his Apostolic Letter Rosarium Virginis Mariae, the pontif's personal motto "Totus Tuus" was inspired by St. Louis' doctrine on total consecration to the Virgin Mary, which he quoted:

“Our entire perfection consists in being conformed, united and consecrated to Jesus Christ. Hence the most perfect of all devotions is undoubtedly that which conforms, unites and consecrates us most perfectly to Jesus Christ.

Now, since Mary is of all creatures the one most conformed to Jesus Christ, it follows that among all devotions that which most consecrates and conforms a soul to our Lord is devotion to Mary, his Holy Mother, and that the more a soul is consecrated to her the more will it be consecrated to Jesus Christ."[2]

In an address to the Montfortian Fathers, the pontiff also said that his reading Saint Louis de Montfort's work The True Devotion to Mary was a "decisive turning point" in his life[3]. On September 19th 1996, Pope John-Paul II made a papal trip to Saint-Laurent-sur-Sèvre to meditate and pray on the adjacent tombs of Saint Louis de Montfort and Blessed Marie Louise Trichet, whom he beatified himself.

His encyclical Redemptoris Mater further emphasizes his focus on Mariology[4].

source


The caption on the image below reads: "Coat of Arms of Pope John Paul II. The letter M in the Marian Cross is for Mary, Jesus' mother."
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Yada
#53 Posted : Wednesday, August 20, 2008 9:29:26 AM
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EWTN is featuring this image on their home page today:

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Robskiwarrior
#54 Posted : Wednesday, August 20, 2008 9:45:17 AM
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*vomits*
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bitnet
#55 Posted : Wednesday, August 20, 2008 10:41:55 AM
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Shalom,

I seem to be having a problem getting the pictures now. Would Mozilla Firefox and derivatives like Flock have a problem with the pics? This only happened after the upgrade.
The reverence of Yahweh is the beginning of Wisdom.
Matthew
#56 Posted : Wednesday, August 20, 2008 6:38:03 PM
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bitnet wrote:
Shalom,

I seem to be having a problem getting the pictures now. Would Mozilla Firefox and derivatives like Flock have a problem with the pics? This only happened after the upgrade.


Me too! Can't see a thing, just a tiny blue box. Says people have downloaded it, but it doesn't give me that option. And I'm using IE7.

But I just visted EWTN! To vomit is a natural response by a believer in Yahushua.

If you click on the picture on EWTN it opens up this link, http://www.ewtn.com/library/ENCYC/P12CAELI.HTM, see if you can stomach that!
Yada
#57 Posted : Wednesday, August 20, 2008 7:58:41 PM
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Could I ask you guys to post your comments regarding not being able to see the images under the "new forum software" thread in the announcement section? That way, we can keep all of the appropriate comments together in one place for our web master.

Thanks.

Regarding the EWTN link, here's the opening paragraph from Pope Pius XII's letter:

Quote:
Encyclical AD CAELI REGINAM
Pope Pius XII

(proclaiming the Queenship of Mary)

To the Venerable Brethren, the Patriarchs, Primates, Archbishops, Bishops and other Local Ordinaries in Peace and Communion with the Holy See.

Venerable Brethren, Health and Apostolic Blessing.

From the earliest ages of the Catholic Church a Christian people, whether in time of triumph or more especially in time of crisis, has addressed prayers of petition and hymns of praise and veneration to the Queen of Heaven. And never has that hope wavered which they placed in the Mother of the Divine King, Jesus Christ; nor has that faith ever failed by which we are taught that Mary, the Virgin Mother of God, reigns with a mother's solicitude over the entire world, just as she is crowned in heavenly blessedness with the glory of a Queen...

read on

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Matthew
#58 Posted : Thursday, August 21, 2008 11:09:42 AM
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Check out point 16 of that article:

Quote:
16. The Blessed Virgin, sitting at the right hand of God to pray for us is hailed by another writer of that same era in these words, "the Queen of mortal man, the most holy Mother of God."
Yada
#59 Posted : Saturday, August 30, 2008 4:44:22 AM
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Mark your calendars - you won't want to miss it. Accordingy to EWTN:

Quote:
BIRTH OF MARY
September 8th
A. Valentini

The present Feast forms a link between the New and the Old Testament. It shows that Truth succeeds symbols and figures and that the New Covenant replaces the Old. Hence, all creation sings with joy, exults, and participates in the joy of this day.... This is, in fact, the day on which the Creator of the world constructed His temple; today is the day on which by a stupendous project a creature becomes the preferred dwelling of the Creator" (Saint Andrew of Crete).

"Let us celebrate with joy the birth of the Virgin Mary, of whom was born the Sun of Justice.... Her birth constitutes the hope and the light of salvation for the whole world.... Her image is light for the whole Christian people" (From the Liturgy).

Read on (if you dare)
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Yada
#60 Posted : Tuesday, September 02, 2008 8:10:32 PM
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Quote:
Thursday, August 28, 2008
Devotion in a forsaken land

(Matthew Streib is traveling across the country on his bicycle exploring religious sites that are inspiring and uniquely American. You can read more about his travels at http://www.americanpilgrimage.com.)

BYRNESVILLE, Pa. - The term "ghost town" generally conjures up images of tumbleweeds and abandoned saloons, not picturesque green hillsides in central Pennsylvania. But other than ominous clouds of steam and carbon monoxide, nothing is left of the tiny town of Byrnesville, except the Virgin Mary.
Byrnesville was demolished by the government in 1990s due to the dangerous conditions caused by an underground coal mine fire that started in nearby Centralia in 1962. Once a town of 28 families, now there is nothing but empty streets, a fractured highway, and vacant lots. The only people who come here are tourists to see the destruction and Mike and Jim Reilley, devoted sons who keep up the town's shrine to Mary, the last standing structure.

"I don't really go to church anymore," says Mike, who trims the shrubs, cleans the stone, and replaces the statue when vandals steal it. A Catholic, he also prays to the Virgin Mary, who has been said to work miracles for inhabitants who pilgrimage from neighboring towns. "In a way, this has become my expression of faith," he says.

Mike lived in Byrnesville for almost 50 years before he evacuated due to loss of electricity, water, and the danger of carbon monoxide seeping in through the basement. When he was 15 (he's now 72), his father dreamt up the idea of the shrine, and the whole family built it out of concrete and old bathtubs. He misses the town deeply, and maintains a website to remind people of the town's history.

"There were blueberries all over the place, blackberries, huckleberries, and we'd go out in the woods all the time," he says. "The coal mines were actually a nuisance -- they'd be digging for coal, with big shovels, dirt, and lots of noise. But it was also entertainment. We'd be sitting there, watching the trucks go by, with all the lights on at night."

The coal fires under the ground still burn, and have enough fuel to last for another 250 years. The town is uninhabitable, and will remain so indefinitely. But for the two brothers who so loved the town, its memory will never die.

source
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bitnet
#61 Posted : Wednesday, September 03, 2008 1:18:49 AM
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Shalom,

It is rather upsetting that this worship of Mary has gone to such levels. That said, I just felt that we should have some respect for Messiyah Yahushua's mother (we certainly would meet her in the Kingdom), but should feel free to speak out against the practice of elevating her to such lofty positions that it misleads people. How the Catholics figure out that "she is sitting at the right hand of God to pray for us" is another mystery, another piece of the puzzle of Mystery Babylon. If you think about it, if all those good people went to heaven are looking out for us and praying for us, they are not doing a very good job, are they? All these world's problems that plague us reflect their inadequacy in reaching the ears of the Creator. Furthermore, if they are seeing all the problems that are here on earth, and what their children are doing, I think they'd be horrified! They definitely won't be getting any peace up there looking at us down here! ;-p
The reverence of Yahweh is the beginning of Wisdom.
Matthew
#62 Posted : Wednesday, September 03, 2008 8:59:35 AM
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Quote:
carbon monoxide seeping in through the basement

Possibly a warning from Yah that worshiping Mary leads to hell? I think so! It will even make to smell like hell.

bitnet
#63 Posted : Wednesday, September 03, 2008 9:33:02 AM
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Er, not to be too nitpicky but carbon monoxide is a colourless, odorless gas. It kills you and you do not even know it.
The reverence of Yahweh is the beginning of Wisdom.
Matthew
#64 Posted : Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:22:02 AM
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bitnet wrote:
Er, not to be too nitpicky but carbon monoxide is a colourless, odorless gas. It kills you and you do not even know it.


Oops, let's just pretend my last sentence isn't there.
Swalchy
#65 Posted : Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:38:58 AM
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Matthew wrote:
Oops, let's just pretend my last sentence isn't there.


I can delete your post if you want :P
Yahweh doesn't want religion anywhere near His most greatest sacrifice.

Matthew
#66 Posted : Wednesday, September 03, 2008 11:55:33 AM
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Swalchy wrote:
I can delete your post if you want :P

No worries, I left it especially because then bitnet's post would've not made sense. Let's leave the running commentary as is :)
Yada
#67 Posted : Wednesday, September 03, 2008 8:34:28 PM
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EWTN ran this "Memorare" prayer to Mary as kind of an infomercial - complete with scrolling text and set to music:

Quote:
Remember, O most gracious Virgin Mary,
that never was it known that anyone who fled to your protection,
implored your help or sought your intercession,
was left unaided.

Inspired with this confidence,
I fly to you, O Virgin of virgins, my Mother;
to you do I come, before you I stand, sinful and sorrowful.

O Mother of the Word Incarnate,
despise not my petitions,
but in your mercy hear and answer me.

source


Apparently, if you recite this prayer, you get a 'partial indulgence.'

Yeah, right.
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Yada
#68 Posted : Sunday, September 07, 2008 10:23:06 AM
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The caption on the photo below reads:

Quote:
Pope Benedict XVI lights a candle in front of the statue of Our Lady of Bonaria as he celebrates a Mass during a Pastoral visit in the Sardinian town of Cagliari September 7, 2008. Pope Benedict said he was praying for the people of Haiti, which has been struck by three successive storms, and hoped enough aid would arrive there.
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Yada
#69 Posted : Monday, September 08, 2008 7:15:37 PM
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So that you don't miss it, according to EWTN, today is the Feast of the Exaltation of the Cross. I'm still trying to figure out who all these people are and what they're all doing standing in front of what appears to be the sun, but I did learn from one of their commentators that Mary "endured all the pain that 'Christ' suffered on the cross" including her heart actually being pierced at the same time that Jesus' heart was peirced. Also, that she can assume "all the sins and punishment of all of mankind." She is also the "sole dispenser of grace" a the "co-redeemer" with Christ.

Oh boy.
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Yada
#70 Posted : Friday, September 12, 2008 9:21:55 PM
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With the Pope visiting France, making a special trip to the "Shrine of Our Lady" at Lourdes where the RCC claims an apparition appeard in a grotto, I wondered whether 'grottos' had any special significance or history within paganism. Sure enough, it turns out that grottos were often used to conduct pagan rituals. In fact, I came across this reference from a review to, "The Pagan Book of Days: A Guide to the Festivals, Traditions, and Sacred Days of the Year, by Nigel Pennick:"

Quote:
"Did you know the grotto at Lourdes was a pagan shrine before the miracle of the "Blessed Mother's" appearance?"


Interestingly, many groups practicing Satanism today include 'grotto' in the title of their organization.

Scary.
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#71 Posted : Friday, September 12, 2008 9:38:25 PM
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I found this online - it's a listing of various "Marion" apparitions:

Quote:
1. Lourdes, South-West France, 1858:

On a freezing day in Februrary 1858, Bernadette Soubirous, an illiterate pauper, claimed she had seen a “lady dressed in white” holding a rosary. Seventeen more apparitions followed, during which the vision urged Bernadette to pray for the conversion of sinners, and, on one occasion, to scratch the ground in front of her. A well bubbled up, said to have miraculous properties, and with it a tradition that the Lourdes waters could heal the sick. Though six million Catholics now visit Lourdes annually, Bernadette was initially declared fit for the lunatic asylum by the local press, but later entered a convent.

2. Fatima, Portugal, 1917:

Three child shepherds claimed that a “lady, brighter than the sun” had appeared to them, with a message of prayer for peace and the conversion of sinners. She also confided “three secrets” to them. When news of the visions spread, a provincial governor had the children arrested, imprisoned and threatened to throw each in a boiling vat of oil unless they retracted their story. They refused. Thousands turned up for the final vision in October 1917. Many reported they saw the sun turn red, and rotate, zig-zagging towards the earth. Two of the seers died young, the third, who became a nun, died in 2005. The Vatican revealed the Third Secret in 2000, but the contents, involving the shooting of a bishop and interpreted as the assassination attempt on John Paul II in 1982, disappointed some believers. They maintain the Vatican is still concealing the secret’s final, and supposedly terrifying, conclusion.

3. Guadalupe, Tepayac, Mexico, 1531:

Mexicans believe in only two things, the Mexican writer Octavio Paz once declared: the lottery, and the Virgin of Guadelupe. In 1531, a Mexican Indian, Juan Diego told his bishop he had seen a vision of a lady dressed as an Indian princess on a hill near Mexico City. The bishop told Diego to ask for a sign and the vision instructed him to fill his cloak with roses plucked from the hill nearby. When Diego opened the cloak before the bishop, the roses had vanished. In their place was an imprint of the lady in the vision. A handy tale which eased the Spanish conquest of Mexico, though it is claimed the original cloth has been subjected to numerous tests which prove the image was not painted onto the cloak. Portrayed standing on a half-crescent moon, the Virgin of Guadalupe is associated by Catholics with the woman “Clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet” described in the Book of Revelation (12:1)

4. Walsingham, England.1061:

A wealthy Norfolk widow claimed the Virgin Mary appeared to her in a dream, taking her to Nazareth to see the house where Jesus had grown up. On the Virgin’s orders, a replica, known as “the Holy House” was built in Walsingham. It remained England's principal Marian shrine until the Reformation. Still a Marian hotspot for RCs and smells-and-bells Anglicans.

5. Medjugorje, Bosnia. 1981 - present day, allegedly.

Probably the most controversial of all Marian apparitions, for the simple reason that the apparitions are said to be ongoing. Only two of the original group of six Bosnian teenagers who first claimed they had seen the Virgin Mary in 1981, now purportedly receive visions and messages from the Madonna daily. With a focus on the need for daily prayer, Bible reading, regular Mass and Confession and – toughest of all – fasting – Medjugorje attracts two million visitors yearly. Some report dramatic spiritual conversions or a return to faith. However, the Vatican remains strangely silent, and local bishops are less than supportive.

6. El Zeitoun, Cairo, 1968:
Millions, including President Nasser of Eygpt, claimed they saw the Madonna and an occasional luminous dove floating above the Orthodox church of Saint Mary. The Coptic Pope, Kyrillos VI, pronounced these apparitions genuine following Church-led investigations.

7. Akita, Japan. 1973.
A deaf Japanese nun not only saw Mary, but also purportedly received the stigmata (the wounds of the crucified Christ) and owned a weeping statue of Mary. How’s that for luck? She said she was cured of deafness by drinking Lourdes water, allegedly. All kosher, according to the Vatican.

8. Garabandal, Spain: 1961-65.
Four pre-pubescent girls said they saw the Archangel Gabriel and Mary, but the Catholic Church declined to believe them.

9. Knock, Ireland, 1879:
A multi-cast vision, starring Mary, Joseph, St John the Evangelist and Jesus (as the lamb of God). A local crowd, ranging in age from five to 75 saw this one, and Catholic nationalists dubbed Our Lady of Knock “Queen of Ireland” in a bid to dispute that title being assumed by Queen Victoria. John Paul II visited in 1979, but the Church has not formally stated an approval.

10. Surbiton, England,1984 – 2007:
Crushingly, the Vatican dismissed as “exaggerated” and “hysterical” the claims of Patricia de Menezes, a freelance jewellery designer, that the Virgin Mary was appearing in a pine tree in the back garden.

source
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Yada
#72 Posted : Saturday, September 13, 2008 2:28:22 AM
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I was doing a little reading about the apparition that Bernadette saw at Lourdes. The following is an account in her own words that took place during one of her initial encounters:

Quote:
I was not afraid to die, but I was terrified by the voices coming from the back of the grotto. They were evil voices clashing in a guttural, angry way. "Save yourself, get out of here," they shrieked. The Lady raised her eyes, frowned at where the voices were,—and there was peace.


I wondered who these "evil voices" were? Perhaps the apparition brought her whole entourage along to the grotto and they were actually mocking Bernadette as she unwittingly (but willfully) sank deeper into this deception.

Any thoughts?

You can read Bernadettes account in her own words here.
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Yahshuaslavejeff
#73 Posted : Saturday, September 13, 2008 10:13:24 PM
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QUOTE Just reading that makes me feel wrong (like I am inadvertantly worshiping her). I had to skim, and then I didn't even skim it all. END QUOTE

this thread on this site is uniquely out of harmony....

"do not study the other nations nor practice their ways" and
"do not even let the names of other gods be found on your lips" is YHWH's stated, written Word. (is it different in Hebrew..?.. stronger I expect .. ? )

It looks clear that
the words and the pictures on this thread, even just skimming over, are grossly unrighteous, and should not fill anyone's eyes or have place in anyone's thoughts .....


Yada
#74 Posted : Sunday, September 14, 2008 7:41:59 PM
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From CNN:

Quote:
Pope holds Mass for thousands at Lourdes

Story Highlights
* Benedict urges pilgrims to remain hopeful in the face of evil and hardship
* Mass marks the 150th anniversary of a peasant girl's religious visions
* Benedict spent Saturday at a hermitage, after praying at Lourdes grotto
* Pope drank water in the grotto, which believers says has healing power

LOURDES, France (AP) -- Pope Benedict XVI celebrated Mass on Sunday at the Lourdes shrine renowned for miracles, telling tens of thousands of faithful pilgrims they should hold onto hope in a world full of evil, torture, suffering and injustice.

Read on

Pope travels in France 1:57
Benedict XVI prays at one of Catholicism's most famous shrines, giving heart to the sick. CNN's Jim Bittermann reports


One interesting line from the article below:

Quote:
Benedict told the crowd that the cross initiates the faithful into the mysteries of Christian faith, including that "there is a love in this world that is stronger than death, stronger than our weaknesses and sins."


Hmm..."mysteries of the Christian faith?," "love in this world being stronger than death?" It sure would have been nice he he could have worked Yahushua into the speech.
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bitnet
#75 Posted : Monday, September 15, 2008 1:01:35 AM
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Shalom,

I hear you, Yada, and it is precisely because of this perceived defilement that I have been skimming over most of the posts here. But nowadays we cannot help hearing all these other names being bandied around, especially in a multiracial multireligious society as found in Malaysia. It also applies to the other threads about Islam that you constantly update. I do not envy you having to bear this for the sake of the kehillat just so that we may understand the errors presented and not repeat it. Hope that you shall remain in good health and unaffected by all of this and that you shall have a great time during the coming Fall Feasts.
The reverence of Yahweh is the beginning of Wisdom.
Yada
#76 Posted : Friday, September 19, 2008 12:45:54 PM
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EWTN was promoting this item today on their "Religious Catalog" - #846 "The Cross of Compassion." Here's a description:

Quote:
CROSS OF COMPASSION
This unique crucifix depicts Our Lady of Sorrows holding a chalice as if to catch Jesus' Precious Blood. Made of resin and stained to look like wood. Measures 11" high


Check out the pyramid with the "all seeing eye" at top center. If I recall, this same symbol appears on the back of our own currency. Funny that.

source

I sent a copy of the photo below to Craig. This was his response:

Quote:
This is stunning. Not only is there the all seeing eye of Horis, the Egyptian sun god, and the Egyptian sun oriented pyramid, we have not one, but two sun god halos, a sun god cross, a Babylonian Madonna who was impregnated by the sun (shown above her), becoming the Mother of God and Queen of Heaven, even "Our Lady of Sorrows (the reason for Lent)," a graven image, and "Jesus" nailed to the cross where he is rendered helpless and powerless--exactly what the religious sorts crave.

CW

So what do you think about the nationalization of Wall Street? To hell with free enterprise and the US Constitution, with a couple of trillion dollars of dept based currency, the Fed can destroy the value of the dollar, bankrupt the Federal government, rob American citizens, and establish a Fascist state with them at the helm. It's a four for one slight of hand. And there is hardly a voice of descent.

If there were any question that America would be rendered meaningless internationally prior to the Tribulation, consistent with prophecy, the most resent evidence is compelling.


From CNN:

Quote:
'Absolute hell, uncertainty' 2:43
ITN's Bridgid Nzekwu looks back at the tumultuous financial week.
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#77 Posted : Friday, September 19, 2008 12:57:45 PM
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I thought I would post this photo of a recent Papal Mass in Italy. It seems that the veneration of "Tammuz" is alive and well.
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#78 Posted : Sunday, September 28, 2008 11:21:37 AM
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I found this free book, "Blinded by the Sun," online and thought I'd post a link to it here. I quickly scanned several sections and, while I did not agree with author on several points, I thought it did contain some useful information - especially relating the the origins of many Catholic practices. Here are the Table of Contents:

Quote:
Table of Contents


Dedication..........................................................................i
Introduction ......................................................................ii
1. Keep Christ in Christmas ...................................................1
2. How it all Started ............................................................3
3. Free Will ......................................................................5
Water Water Everywhere .......................................................6
4. The Unholy Trinity – Cush, Semiramis and Nimrod ......................8
Cush ............................................................................8
Semiramis ......................................................................9
Nimrod ........................................................................10
5. A New Religion ..............................................................15
6. The Roman Influence .....................................................18
7. Constantine the Great .....................................................20
8. X marks the Spot ...........................................................22
The Sign of the Cross ..........................................................23
9. All Hail Caesar .............................................................25
10. A Spiritual Blender .......................................................28
11. A Day to be Honored ......................................................30
12. You Can’t See the Forest for the Trees .................................32
13. “Yule” be Sorry ............................................................35
The Vatican Obelisk ..........................................................37
Yule logs .....................................................................39
O Tannenbaum ...............................................................40
14. Very Superstitious .........................................................41
Mistletoe ......................................................................41
Holly ...........................................................................42

15. “Claus” – it Christians ....................................................43
Saint Nicholas .................................................................44
The Power of Suggestion ......................................................46
Godly Fear and Wisdom .......................................................47
Santa – christ .................................................................49
Santa and his Merry Band of Elves ............................................50
16. The Wreath of God .........................................................52
The Olympics .................................................................52
Christmas Wreaths ............................................................53
Saint Lucia’s Crown ...........................................................54
17. Can a Leopard Change it’s Spots? ......................................56
18. And Then Along Comes Mary ...........................................59
Penance .......................................................................65
Guadalupe – the goddess of the Americas .....................................68
The Crown of Mary ............................................................73
Peace, Peace ...................................................................76
19. The Rosary – A Very Thorny Issue .....................................78
20. Everything Old is New Again ............................................85
21. Its Made Official ...........................................................87
22. The Mass Appeal of a Magic Wafer ....................................89
Behold your god! ..............................................................93
The Lord’s Supper .............................................................96
The Lamb of God ..............................................................98
Christ in the Passover ........................................................100
The Last Supper ..............................................................102
23. In Memoriam .............................................................104
24. Here Comes the Sun .....................................................110
Easter .........................................................................111
Lent ..........................................................................120
Good Friday ..................................................................122
The True Sabbath .............................................................127

25. It is Finished ..............................................................129
26. Who is this Jesus? ........................................................131
27. The Roman – Babylon Connection ...................................133
28. Tradition or Truth? ......................................................136
29. Nothing New Under the Sun ...........................................142
King Manasseh ...............................................................142
King Jeroboam ...............................................................143
King Solomon ........................................................................144
The Feasts of the Lord .......................................................145
30. Happy Birthday to Who? ...............................................147
The false christ ...............................................................148
The Anti-christ ...............................................................150
Liar Lair Pants on Fire .......................................................150
Cain and Abel ................................................................151
31. The spirit of Christmas ..................................................153
The Queen of heaven .........................................................154
The spirit of Motherhood .....................................................155
Mama of the Congregation ...................................................156
The Baby Jesus ...............................................................163
32. The Mother of God ......................................................164
33. Unto Us a Holiday is Born ..............................................178
The land of Goshen ...........................................................179
Separation is not a Four-Letter Word .......................................180
34. Does Truth Really Matter? .............................................183
Blaming Fire .................................................................184
Let’s Just Praise the Lord? ...................................................187
Seriously Deceived ...........................................................188
35. But That’s Not Me! .......................................................189
It’s a Heart Thing ............................................................190
36. A Little Bit of U.S. History ..............................................192
The English Puritans .........................................................194

37. Accountability .............................................................197
TBN ..........................................................................197
The TBN Praise-a-thon .......................................................199
Paul Crouch and Rome ......................................................202
Paul Crouch and the Protestant Reformation ................................207
Touch Not Mine Anointed ...................................................208
Judge Not ....................................................................212
38. Benny Hinn, TBN and Rome ...........................................215
A Personal Testimony .......................................................227
The Day of the Dead ..........................................................229
Fire from Heaven ............................................................232
Questioning the Miracles ....................................................233
Hidden Treasure ............................................................235
39. Show Me the Money .....................................................238
Billy Graham ................................................................246
Scriptural Foundation? ......................................................247
1000 Burnt Offerings ........................................................252
The Business of Church ......................................................256
The Modern Day Sale of Indulgences ........................................260
True Giving ..................................................................262
40. The One World Church .................................................265
All Roads Lead to Rome ......................................................267
The Pope of the People .......................................................270
Pope John Paul II and Islam .................................................271
John Paul II and Judaism ....................................................273
The Last Days Temple ........................................................275
41. The Last Days Remnant ..................................................278
The Seven Year Tribulation ..................................................280
The Signs of Noah and Lot ...................................................282
Persecution and Apostasy ...................................................284
The Sixth Seal – The Sign of the Son of Man .................................285

42. Oh, How the Mighty are Fallen ........................................291
If it walks like a duck .........................................................292
The Reason for the Seasons ..................................................293
43. The Spirit of Truth ........................................................295
44. The Cost .....................................................................297
45. Epilogue ...................................................................300
Time for a Change ............................................................301
The Call .......................................................................302
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Yada
#79 Posted : Friday, October 03, 2008 7:25:12 AM
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I stumbled across this on YouTube. Check out the figure of Mary, which I think, astrides a representation of the Ark of The Covenant on the altar. Not to be believed.



Interestingly, on the same page was this short video about the origins/meaning of the word "Vatican." Part I is here.

Part II is here.

And, if you're in the mood for a little Beatles redition of "Here Comes the Sun," check out "Catholics and Sun Worship."
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In His Name
#80 Posted : Friday, October 03, 2008 12:30:16 PM
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That is SICK. and I don't mean that in a good way.
“Because he clings to Me, is joined to Me, loves and delights in Me, desires Me, therefore I will deliver him, carry him safely away, cause him to escape from harm making him inaccessible and strong, and delivering him safely to heaven, because he has known, observed, cared for, recognized, instructed and advised others to use, designated, acknowledged, discerned, answered in, My name, authority, character, report, mark, and nature." Psalm 91:14
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