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Offline Matthew  
#1 Posted : Friday, March 7, 2008 9:42:20 AM(UTC)
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YY - Book 1 - Genesis - Chapter 2 - Owr - Yada wrote:
Therefore on average, these four measurements serve to confirm that one day in the Creator’s life at creation would seem like 0.9 x 10^12 days to us. And none of this should be surprising since Yahweh consistently equates His nature to light, and since we now know that at the velocity of light, time stands still. Eternity only exists in the presence of the Light.


My focus is on the last sentence "Eternity only exists in the presence of the Light." What about in the case of the Abyss, which is the place of eternal separation. It is my understanding that the Abyss is the absence of Light (Yahuweh), so how can it be eternal then?

I think this is quite a good question ;)

Edited by user Friday, March 7, 2008 11:51:30 AM(UTC)  | Reason: Not specified

Offline Robskiwarrior  
#2 Posted : Friday, March 7, 2008 1:50:18 PM(UTC)
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Matthew wrote:

I think this is quite a good question ;)


I think you are right! lol
Signature Updated! Woo that was old...
Offline bitnet  
#3 Posted : Friday, March 7, 2008 11:25:58 PM(UTC)
bitnet
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Shalom All,

Show me the darkness in a closed can and perhaps I can show you eternity. :-)
The reverence of Yahweh is the beginning of Wisdom.
Offline Robskiwarrior  
#4 Posted : Friday, March 7, 2008 11:50:20 PM(UTC)
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lol now your are getting into the "whats sound does a tree make when falling in the woods when there is no one around to hear it" thingy :)
Signature Updated! Woo that was old...
Offline Matthew  
#5 Posted : Wednesday, March 12, 2008 9:48:27 AM(UTC)
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YY - Book 1 - Genesis - Chapter 4 - Shabat - Yada wrote:
Yahuweh created the Abyss as a prison for Halal ben Shachar, better known as Satan, and for the divisions who rebelled with him.


I found my answer reading a few pages more. Therefore we know Yahuweh has created the Abyss with eternity as its second main aspect, the first aspect obviously being the absence of the Light.
Offline bitnet  
#6 Posted : Friday, March 28, 2008 7:43:01 PM(UTC)
bitnet
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Shabbat Shalom,

Say... can anyone explain what happens to light in a black hole? And what dark matter (comprising a significant portion of the universe) really is? And how it relates to this topic? :-) We may be surprised at the answers!
The reverence of Yahweh is the beginning of Wisdom.
Offline Matthew  
#7 Posted : Saturday, March 29, 2008 8:09:34 AM(UTC)
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Bitnet, I believe Yada gives some insight into the answers you're seeking, I've copied and pasted the relevant section from YY - Book 1 - Genesis - Chapter 6 - Nesamah:

Quote:
"Yahuweh, God, said to the serpent (nahas - viper, poisonous reptile, and venomous snake), ‘Because (kiy) you have done (‘asah) this (zo’t) you have brought a curse upon yourself (‘arar - invoked injury, misfortune, affliction, and harm, earning retribution) more than any (min kol) class of living being (bahemah - beast or animal), more than any form of life (hayah - conscious existence) in the realm (sadeh - open environs outside the walled enclosure). On (‘al) your belly[/b] (gahon - the part of a reptile which makes contact with the ground) you shall move about (halak - travel, proceed, exist, and live), and dirt (‘apar - the minute elements or particles which comprise matter) you shall eat (‘akal - consume) all (kol) the days (yowm) of your (‘atah) lives (hayim - suffering anguish in distress).’" (Genesis 3:14)

For there to be justice, there must be recompense. For a judge to be moral, he must punish those who deceive, destroy, steal, and kill. Satan used half truths, a counterfeit, and a straw man to delude Chawah, destroying her relationship with Yahweh, robbing her of her home, and stealing her mortal soul. For that, Satan will be punished.

The sentence, however, was not death. Spirits, unlike souls, are all immortal. Even God cannot kill them. So that is why the misfortune the Adversary brought upon himself, his retribution, will be eternal anguish. Satan will be incarcerated for all but the last fleeting moments of the Sukah Millennial Sabbath. He will be released and will use similar tactics to deprive many of those born during the thousand year right, causing them to be wrong with God. This will be the final rebellion and then Satan, his fellow demons, as well as all of those who leagued with him, will be tested and found wanting in the lake of fire. Passing through it, they will find themselves in an eternal prison called the Abyss. Made especially for Satan and his colleagues, this penitentiary is indistinguishable from a black hole. It is a lightless place of emotional anguish separated from God. It is a place where the pressures are so intense, the minute particles which comprise matter are consumed. Ultimately it becomes a one dimensional construct where only time exists.

There are three ways to interpret this message. The simplest would have been understood by the first people to hear the story. Satan acted badly and was punished. Groveling on one’s belly and eating dirt has never been good.

Spiritually, the Adversary was cast down and as a result he spends his days devouring mankind. Adam was created from the very substance Satan was predicted to consume.

Scientifically, the leading astrophysicist of our day, Stephen Hawkins, has invested the last decade of his life in the advancement of the theory which is suggested here - that matter can be consumed. He has postulated that this condition exists within the confines of black holes. While most scientists despise his conclusion, knowing that physics itself is based upon the conservation of matter, Hawkins is merely reporting what Yahweh has revealed. The first thing God said He will do following the Millennial Sabbath is to completely destroy the entire universe. But don’t be alarmed. He will instantaneously create a new one, this time with us as witnesses in addition to beneficiaries.


Concerning "dark matter," copied from YY - Book 1 - Genesis - Chapter 1 - Hayah:

Quote:
In truth, the Big Bang theory cannot even explain how galaxies formed. So that which is purported to be science, and thus is assumed to be testable, and taught as fact, and thus assumed to be true, is neither. The simple truth is: at the moment scientists don’t know much when it comes to the substance of the universe.

But don’t accept my testimony on this, consider P.J.E. Peebles’ conclusion. He is the acknowledged leader in the field of universal beginnings, professor of Cosmology at Princeton University: "Cosmology - the study of the beginnings, formation, and evolution of our Universe - is currently in a badly confused state. At the moment, scientists don’t know what makes up 99% of the Universe. This, needless to say, is a rather embarrassing situation. Although much of what is visible in the Universe is becoming comprehensible, with great recent strides in understanding star formation, galactic structure, and spectacular events such as supernovae, it would appear that there is another component of the universe - possibly making up most of its mass - which we cannot see, and we do not understand."

Turning to Someone who does understand, Genesis 1:2 reveals that while the scientific term "dark matter" is only a score of years old, Yahweh has always been familiar with the concept: "The natural material of which things are comprised (‘erets) exists (hayah) formless (tohu), as an empty void (bohu), obscured in darkness (chosek) along with the presence of the inaccessible and mysterious depths." If they only knew where to look, scientists would have long ago come to recognize that God was explaining what happened, defining the very terms "Big Bang" and "Dark Matter" which astronomers and physicists would come to ponder.

But there was much more to God’s message. Yahweh was also introducing the concept of relationship and separation in these opening verses. We must choose which side of the divide we want to be on - darkness, confusion, and lifelessness or light, instruction, and life - the family or the void. It should be no surprise then that light, instruction, and life occupy Yahweh’s thoughts over the first three days of creation and that on the fourth day He presents the ultimate guide to them.

While we are on the subject of God knowing that which man does not know, of God being light, and of man stumbling in the darkness, the most recent tests conducted by the Wilkinson Microwave Anisotropy Probe satellite experiment show that dark energy, the force which is unknown to man, occupies 73% of the energy of the universe, and dark matter, the effect which is unknown to man, represents 23% of universal content. Thus our known and testable theories can only account for 4% of the energy and matter in the universe. All we know about Dark Energy is that it is both ubiquitous and repulsive and that its relationship to Dark Matter suggests fine-tuning manifest through intelligent design.


KP also gives us some insight concerning light inside a black hole, copied from FH - Chapter 29 - The Three Doors:

Quote:
And in the end, their destiny is eternal darkness. “These are wells without water, clouds carried by a tempest, for whom is reserved the blackness of darkness forever.” (II Peter 2:17) Wells without water promise to slake the thirst, but provide nothing of value. You can’t drink false hope. Nor does the parched land benefit from clouds that merely scud by overhead. A false promise is far more cruel than silence. Therefore, those who lead the spiritually unborn astray, those who conspire to keep them from experiencing the light of Yahweh’s love, have a confirmed reservation in Hotel Hell, described here as “the blackness of darkness.” And their stay is described as forever. As the Eagles’ old rock anthem put it, “You can check out any time you like, but you can never leave.”

It’s an interesting phrase: “the blackness of darkness.” The Greek zophos means deep gloom, the blackest darkness of hell. And skotos is the word for the darkness of night, also indicating “darkened eyesight or blindness; the darkness of ignorance respecting divine things and human duties, and the accompanying ungodliness and immorality, together with their consequent misery in hell.” (Strong’s) Scientists tell us that there are places within every galaxy called “black holes,” where the gravitational pressure is so great that not even light can escape. Crushing, voracious, and utterly lightless, these black holes provide an apt metaphor for what hell is like. (And who knows? Perhaps they’re more than metaphors. Could it be that Yahweh has reserved a black hole for each soul inhabited by Satan’s spirit? This thought is obviously beyond SF10 on my speculation scale, but that doesn’t mean it couldn’t be true.)
Offline bitnet  
#8 Posted : Sunday, March 30, 2008 6:46:51 AM(UTC)
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Shalom Matthew,

Thanks for posting this reply, and it really is the answer that I wanted to post to you in the first place in response to your post at the top of the page. Even now there seems to be places where light does not go, so does that mean that Yahweh's presence is not there? Or does it simply mean that such places are not eternal in relation to your question? Where the adversary is thrown to in the future may simply be another dimension where light simply does not exist because Yahweh does not want to go there! But it does not mean that it is not eternal, for as long as Yahweh lives, so would such a place of separation exist for those who wanted to be separate from Him. It's a case of "be careful what you wish for as you may get it."
The reverence of Yahweh is the beginning of Wisdom.
Offline Icy  
#9 Posted : Monday, March 31, 2008 12:46:37 AM(UTC)
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Where is it that light does not go? There is virtually (and probably no) place on Earth where light does not go. Even at the bottom of the ocean or in the deepest cave on earth, there is still light, usually eminating from the creatures that live there. Also, light that is outside of the visible spectrum penetrates through things and is everywhere.
Offline Matthew  
#10 Posted : Monday, March 31, 2008 9:17:11 AM(UTC)
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One reason why I don't think black holes might not be the Abyss is because they are part of this universe which I am told will pass away when Yahuweh destroys it and creates a new heaven and new earth. If the Abyss is for eternity then is should be a place separate of this universe. Or maybe a black hole is just a wormhole into another universe where there is only one dimension, that of time.

bitnet wrote:
Where the adversary is thrown to in the future may simply be another dimension where light simply does not exist because Yahweh does not want to go there!


I agree, especially created as a place separated from Himself!
Offline Mike_Browell  
#11 Posted : Thursday, April 3, 2008 6:44:06 PM(UTC)
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Peace everyone,

Praise Yahweh in his Wisdom and Power, and may our Dad lift us all up in knowledge. I ask in the name of Yahushua the Annointed Implement of Yahuweh that if this is wrong that I am quickly corrected. Please Dad. And, I appologise for the off topic post and ask that if anyone actually responds I'll start a new topic and if someone has responded before you to wait fro the new topic. Otherwise ignore me and continue posting to this topic

Matthew wrote:


Quote:

In truth, the Big Bang theory cannot even explain how galaxies formed. So that which is purported to be science, and thus is assumed to be testable, and taught as fact, and thus assumed to be true, is neither. The simple truth is: at the moment scientists don’t know much when it comes to the substance of the universe.

But don’t accept my testimony on this, consider P.J.E. Peebles’ conclusion. He is the acknowledged leader in the field of universal beginnings, professor of Cosmology at Princeton University: "Cosmology - the study of the beginnings, formation, and evolution of our Universe - is currently in a badly confused state. At the moment, scientists don’t know what makes up 99% of the Universe. This, needless to say, is a rather embarrassing situation. Although much of what is visible in the Universe is becoming comprehensible, with great recent strides in understanding star formation, galactic structure, and spectacular events such as supernovae, it would appear that there is another component of the universe - possibly making up most of its mass - which we cannot see, and we do not understand."

Turning to Someone who does understand, Genesis 1:2 reveals that while the scientific term "dark matter" is only a score of years old, Yahweh has always been familiar with the concept: "The natural material of which things are comprised (‘erets) exists (hayah) formless (tohu), as an empty void (bohu), obscured in darkness (chosek) along with the presence of the inaccessible and mysterious depths." If they only knew where to look, scientists would have long ago come to recognize that God was explaining what happened, defining the very terms "Big Bang" and "Dark Matter" which astronomers and physicists would come to ponder.

But there was much more to God’s message. Yahweh was also introducing the concept of relationship and separation in these opening verses. We must choose which side of the divide we want to be on - darkness, confusion, and lifelessness or light, instruction, and life - the family or the void. It should be no surprise then that light, instruction, and life occupy Yahweh’s thoughts over the first three days of creation and that on the fourth day He presents the ultimate guide to them.

While we are on the subject of God knowing that which man does not know, of God being light, and of man stumbling in the darkness, the most recent tests conducted by the Wilkinson Microwave Anisotropy Probe satellite experiment show that dark energy, the force which is unknown to man, occupies 73% of the energy of the universe, and dark matter, the effect which is unknown to man, represents 23% of universal content. Thus our known and testable theories can only account for 4% of the energy and matter in the universe. All we know about Dark Energy is that it is both ubiquitous and repulsive and that its relationship to Dark Matter suggests fine-tuning manifest through intelligent design.



I hate to be a stickler and I'm surprised I didn't notice this before, but I'm going to have to bring Yada's math to question here. I accept the figures of 73% unknown energies and 23% matter. Unfortunately comparing the two is like apples and orange so adding them together is really not possible to come up with a cogent number. Though, if you were to do so you woud have to look at it like this... It's 73% of 100% plus 23% of 100%. So, if you added them straight your total would be out of 200% therefore it's more correct (although still completely wrong) that 54% of the universe in unknown.

Loving Kindness from your brother,
BiynaYahu
Offline kp  
#12 Posted : Friday, April 4, 2008 12:17:48 PM(UTC)
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What you're missing, Mike, is that matter and energy are equivalent, as in the special theory of relativity, E=MC(2). Matter can become energy, and vice versa. That would presumably apply in theoretical "dark matter and energy" just as it does in "light matter" (stars and such---material we can see and measure), where Einsten's theory has proven true wherever they've been able to test it. All Yada is saying is that the universe as we perceive it (at the moment) is comprised of 73% dark energy, 23% dark matter, and 4% stuff we can see, light energy and matter, for a total of 100%. And that means we don't know much.

kp
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