logo
Welcome Guest! To enable all features please Login or Register.

Notification

Icon
Error

Options
View
Go to last post Go to first unread
Offline dajstill  
#1 Posted : Thursday, November 29, 2012 5:08:31 AM(UTC)
dajstill
Joined: 11/23/2011(UTC)
Posts: 748
Location: Alabama

Was thanked: 4 time(s) in 4 post(s)
So, I had a social media "friend" try to counter my evil musings by posting a link from the"Messianic Literacy Corner" http://www.messianic-lit...y.com/torah_gentiles.htm with an article titled:

Statements Admonishing Gentile Believers Not To Seek Torah Observance which reads:

Below are links to various doctrinal statements admonishing Gentile believers in Messiah (Christ) not to adopt Jewish customs and Torah observances. Many current Messianic and Hebrew Roots teachings have come to the theological position that the Torah is equally binding on Jews and Gentiles alike. The result is a loss of Jewish-Gentile distinction, causing contention within Messianic ranks and anger towards the Messianic Movement by Christians and Jews alike. The articles below directs us to the biblical wisdom that is mostly rejected by the Messianic Movement today. Such counseling should be "taken to heart" by Messianic believers to avoid more confusion.

******************************
As I went through the links provided I wanted to throw up! They aren't talking about being distinct from Orthodox Judaism, they are literally talking about rejecting "Torah Observance". It is almost like a hit piece against folks waking up to the truth. They use the most ludicrous logic I have ever seen in many of these links. One link on not honoring the Sabbath said :

"THE ARGUMENTS USED FOR SABBATH KEEPING

One argument that is often used in favour of mandatory Sabbath keeping is that Sabbath is a creation ordinance. The scripture they use is found in Genesis:2:2-3

"And on the seventh day God finished His work which he had made: and he rested on the seventh day from all his work which he had made. And God blessed the seventh day and hallowed it because that in it He rested from all His work which God had created and made"

If this was a creation ordinance it would be mandatory on both Jews and Gentiles alike. However in the New Testament the Gentiles are grafted into the Jewish root making the one new man and there is no mandatory, ruling that this ordinance should be obeyed. Furthermore if it is accepted as a creation ordinance it would still not be obligatory to all in the same wave

Dr Arnold Fruchtenbaum puts the case best when he says "Marriage is a creation ordinance {Genesis 2:18-25}but this does not make it obligatory for all ". In fact celibacy or singleness is considered to be an equal option. even superior{1 Cor:7: 1-7}.

This passage is proclaiming God's creative power as well as His triumphant rest. Therefore mandatory Sabbath keeping in the Biblical sense as in Exodus 31:15-I 7. is best kept when like the LORD we rest, especially in the New Testament for we are not under law but under grace. This is where we can find scriptures in the New Testament such as Mark 2:27 and Col. 2:16 also Heb.4: I - 16 Furthermore, I would make this point that appears to cause many to stumble from Exodus 31:17

"It is a sign between Me and the children of Israel forever"

This word "forever" is the word "olam" in Hebrew transliteration, and it means "Till the end of a period of time". and does not mean for eternity. Therefore what period of time would the writer Moses have in mind when he was putting together the book of Exodus simply the time of which the mosaic law was to last. For the LORD had made it known to him that he was going to raise up a Prophet. like himself from among his brethren {Deut..l8:l8-l9}and this is what is meant in Heb .11:39 when it. states "All these. having obtained a good testimony through faith - did not receive the promise" what promise - the promise of HIS rest that only Y'SHUA could bring. The law of Moses has been fulfilled by the death of Y'SHUA. that we can now enter HIS rest. I would further endorse my argument by saying why should we persist in trying to keep a Sabbath from the Mosaic law when more weightier matters have been left out such as the sacrificial system. There is simply no Biblical sense in keeping some Mosaic Laws and not others."
***************************************************

That is absolutely fuzzy logic at best. However, it tells me that people are searching, seeking, and trying and the religious whore keeps trying to beat them back into submission. It is so absolutely angering!

Offline antichrist  
#2 Posted : Friday, November 30, 2012 1:23:20 AM(UTC)
antichrist
Joined: 10/26/2012(UTC)
Posts: 12
Man
Location: Front Range

it is encouraging that the pagan xtian leadership is starting to take notice of those who are seeking God as in Yah as He exists in Towrah exclusively - but they can't change their stripes, and from a xtian leadership position/perspective, it's all about the money...one of the first things i tell those in xtianity to do is to just stop tithing; telling them: i wouldn't give another penny to any church or xtian organization etc...that's got to hurt the religious leaders when people start questioning the need to tithe and give gifts in the form of cash to some circe organization...
The destructive binding cords and disparaging pledges (chebel / chabal) of the wicked who violate the standard (rasa’) which surround me cause me to testify as a witness (‘uwd) that Your Towrah (Towrah) shall not be ignored, overlooked, or forgotten (lo’ sakah).
Offline cgb2  
#3 Posted : Friday, November 30, 2012 7:44:28 AM(UTC)
cgb2
Joined: 5/14/2010(UTC)
Posts: 689
Location: Colorado

Thanks: 16 times
Was thanked: 24 time(s) in 18 post(s)
Sheesh, what a bunch of twisting with Pauline doctrine to over-ride it all. Yep, they much be feeling the pinch, as it's bad for business. Trouble is messianics are still into religion too. Man what a burdensome stone it must be to harmonize and keep Akibba/Mohmedes & Paul....er 613 laws AND Shaw'ul and his many rules too.

In my search, I've pretty much come to the conclusion that if it's religious org with heirarchy, paid clergy, etc....their doctrine will lead one astray. I think the adversary sees to it that there is wealth and power in this life for those who lead others astray.

I still remember when I first stumbled across YY over 3 years ago, and shocked that not even so much as a "donate" button.
Offline dajstill  
#4 Posted : Friday, November 30, 2012 10:07:29 AM(UTC)
dajstill
Joined: 11/23/2011(UTC)
Posts: 748
Location: Alabama

Was thanked: 4 time(s) in 4 post(s)
I wondered where the donate button was as well - LOL!

You want to see Paul in action, this is the most obvious I have seen (and it was also posted by that same xthian) http://sigler.org/walter/law.htm

They are now declaring there were 2 different gods the "Law God" and the "God of Grace". Of course, the "Law God" ended up dying - oh well, what can you do!

My husband is so happy to be out of that mess of a religion he doesn't know that to do.

When I first began my journey I almost got sucked into the Messianic thing. The good thing is that I always "questioned Paul" just a little and that kept me searching until I stumbled upon Yada. I actually found this forum first by googling a Messianic that ended up being discussed on the forum. I was trying to track down more info on who I was listening to. He did some really good research, but he is still a part of the "Messy Club" as I call it now and there is ALWAYS a donate button associated with the Messy Club LOL

Thankfully, cracks are starting to form in the xthian world, more people are questioning. My husband had a great conversation with a co-worker who asked him to forward the link to AITG, so there is still a small glimmer of hope for a few.
Users browsing this topic
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.