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Offline Jason  
#1 Posted : Sunday, October 14, 2012 12:02:01 PM(UTC)
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I called the GCN show this week and asked Yada and Yoel if they would consider returning to a focused amplification of the TP&P, for the benefit of those who are not able to devote the focus and time necessary to amplify the scriptures for themselves, and to publish an amplification of the entire TP&P.

This show aired on this past tuesday show about 30 minutes into the first hour. People reading and responding to this letter would probably understand this post more if they listened to the 15 minutes-or-so portion of the show that was aired.

(I would like to say at this point in the post that I was not asking about any of Yada’s books be made available in print. What I was asking about was making available an amplified english translation of the entire hebrew text, online or otherwise, like the amplification done in YY. If I did not make my question clear I apologize.)

What I was trying to communicate was that in my opinion, an amplification of the entire TP&P would be the most effective way to communicate Yah’s testimony and perspective in english. Far more effective and valuable than Yada’s commentary on the text.

Yoel seemed to be interested and even spoke of the fact that the work they had begun in amplifying the scriptures they had simply not finished. Yada however expressed that he was incapable to doing this. He said he preferred to share his insights instead, and to continue to re-write Yada Yah and Intro to God as his understanding grows.

I think that producing a complete amplification of the hebrew scriptures in english is an important and worthy goal.

I have started this topic to hear from all of you and get the discussion going as to your suggestions and ideas.

I am aware of the limitations of translation, but are we not confronted with many of the same problems when writing commentaries about Yah’s testimony in english? and how difficult do you think it would be, knowing what we know now, to write a translation 1000 times better than every english translation ever before? I think we can all agree that there is potential for vast improvement, even though we can not substitute the hebrew text in its fullness.

What I am currently picturing in my head is a amplified translation that would have the pictographic script available to view at the same time with the amplification and also, it would be helpful to have the amplification and info of each hebrew word in an index of some form.

Ideally yes I would like to start today and get the software and tools to begin doing all this on my own, and I will not neglect to do that when I can, I agree that would be the best and most rewarding method for my own sake, Still it would be nice to have a less polluted translation to study from to bridge the gap between then and now, not just for me, but for many people like me that can only devote so much time in the text and who really genuinely want to accelerate their understanding.

Consider the fact that even if we just took an existing english translation and edited just 5% of what has been uncovered in YY & ITG, we would have the best english translation of Yahwah’s revelation ever written. By far the most clear communication of the hebrew scriptures ever made manifest before in the english language, EVER!. If that is not a worthy objective than what is?

How do you feel about Yahwah’s name, for the first time ever, being transliterated properly 7000 times? I would like to be part of the group that made that happen, or “holy” being completely removed from the text and replaced with set apart, for all to see and study for themselves and the religious community having absolutely no legitimate grounds to argue. This to me is a very compelling prospect.

I would like to say more than anything else to those who are already well equipped and able to engage in this project to please consider doing this! not everyone can devote the time and resources that you can and we need your help! And please leave your commentary at the door, we want to hear from Yahwah!

Jason
Offline cgb2  
#2 Posted : Sunday, October 14, 2012 6:10:22 PM(UTC)
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Yes Jason that would be nice. Sometimes it can take an hour to fully research and properly translate a single verse...only later to come to deeper understanding as one grows and ah shucks, could have done those earlier translations better.

Yes great idea, and with your help too we might pull that off in about 50 years ;^)
Kidding with ya, but we'd all love that.

There's been some effort into this already:
http://forum.yadayahweh....ipture-Only-Version.aspx

For now here's things you might find helpful:
http://forum.yadayahweh....ESword-The-Word-etc.aspx
Offline cgb2  
#3 Posted : Sunday, October 14, 2012 6:17:26 PM(UTC)
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> How do you feel about Yahwah’s name, for the first time ever, being transliterated properly 7000 times? I would like to be part of the group that made that happen, or “holy” being completely removed from the text and replaced with set apart, for all to see and study for themselves and the religious community having absolutely no legitimate grounds to argue. This to me is a very compelling prospect.

You may want to look into ISR "The Scriptures":
http://www.isr-messianic.org/

Although still usual poor translations, at least without the offense of replacing "YHWH/Yahowsha" name, along with removing pagan terms (holy = set apart), also with hebrew names.

Another is http://www.halleluyahscriptures.com/
Offline Jason  
#4 Posted : Monday, October 15, 2012 5:24:08 AM(UTC)
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Thank you cgb2
Offline Jason  
#5 Posted : Monday, October 15, 2012 1:54:33 PM(UTC)
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cgb2, I tried to download the links James posted a while ago compiling the YY amplifications but i got this message " Error: Resource has been moved or is unavailable. Please contact the forum admin."

do you use LOGOS original languages software? what tools should I get? BTW E-sword does not work on my MAC but I do have something similar that includes maps, lexicon and interlinear. do you have smartphone? I have I phone and use an APP called "HebrewBible" by a guy names Bill Clementson. It is actuall a really cool App, its about 10$, has maps and organizes locations with corresponding locations mentioned in each book, the the root word search is really nice too, you can search words in the root search to get past the vowel points barrier in the built in lexicon. You just touch the hebrew word on the touch screen and the definition pops up. Very kool.

Offline James  
#6 Posted : Tuesday, October 16, 2012 3:15:32 AM(UTC)
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Jason wrote:
cgb2, I tried to download the links James posted a while ago compiling the YY amplifications but i got this message " Error: Resource has been moved or is unavailable. Please contact the forum admin."

do you use LOGOS original languages software? what tools should I get? BTW E-sword does not work on my MAC but I do have something similar that includes maps, lexicon and interlinear. do you have smartphone? I have I phone and use an APP called "HebrewBible" by a guy names Bill Clementson. It is actuall a really cool App, its about 10$, has maps and organizes locations with corresponding locations mentioned in each book, the the root word search is really nice too, you can search words in the root search to get past the vowel points barrier in the built in lexicon. You just touch the hebrew word on the touch screen and the definition pops up. Very kool.



They were apparently deleted when the server was updated a while back. I have them saved somewhere, the question is where, I will look for them and re post them when I find them. They are an older version, prior to the most current rewrite of YY, and don't include ITG. I need to break down and go through an re do them all one day, but I've been too busy lately, might dedicate sometime here in a week or so.

The Logos original language software is probably the single best tool on the market. It comes with a lot of great resources, and it's exegetical guide makes studying the Hebrew a lot easier and more efficient.

E-Sword is a good free tool, it has some really good resources, but you have to work a little harder.

My Sword is an excellent app for the android, don't know if it's on iOS or not.

Here is a thread with a bunch of free resources. http://forum.yadayah.com...29_Online-Resources.aspx

The reason I would recommend Logos is that it puts it all in one place, and links it together. So while you may be able to compile the resources in online and freeware, they are in different programs, webpages etc, and not linked, so you have to spend a lot more time to get the same amount of research done.

The Original Languages package is the one to get. It has the most helpful tools for studying Hebrew, in fact it has some that aren't in the more expensive packages. In addition I would recommend getting the Theological Word Book of the Old Testament, it is a great resource to have for $50 extra.
Don't take my word for it, Look it up.

“The truth is not for all men but only for those who seek it.” ― Ayn Rand
Offline needhelp  
#7 Posted : Tuesday, October 16, 2012 4:14:15 AM(UTC)
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I have the .rar files for Scripture-only-versions.
Offline Jason  
#8 Posted : Tuesday, October 16, 2012 4:16:12 AM(UTC)
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Thanks James, Logos OLs package is at the top of my to get list, I can't wait to get that and start using it. It is going to take a little time to get set up, and I will have to do some research before I start my research :) but I think I will eventually open a google site or something and start posting my translations for others to view the format I will choose and scrutinize the translation itself. I will try to make it as smooth as possible without excluding the contextually relevant meanings, plus having the full meanings available in an index somewhere. It may be impossible to come to a consensus on all the passages, but I think we can at least have something translated that is far more accurate than any other english translation out there. Plus, those who are engaged in the same activity could copy/paste what was done and tweak it according to their own preferred english terms, that way, at least we could all work off something that has a large percentage of the leaven removed already.

On another note: I will need to get better acquainted with the hebrew and understand (masuline/femanine/singular/plural/imperfect/perfect/first person/third person/ect. I've been to many sites but most if not all have Rabbinic&modern hebrew instructions, I have a hunch that there is some leaven to be purged there too that I am not aware of yet, even in the pronunciation of words I question some of the rules that are to be applied to the text. If anybody recommends a particular site to learn the REAL hebrew please share. The most interesting one I have seen is www.ancient-hebrew.org. But I think there is still a lot of leaven in that lump.

Do you think there may be instruction and conformation of the true pronunciation and other nuances of hebrew in the text itself? Afterall, it is perfect and complete as Dowd wrote, and we are instructed to speak dabar right?

I have been thinking for a while now that maybe within Psalm 119 there is very helpful instruction as to the application of the hebrew, not just in observing the Towrah,Pikood,Choq,Mitwah, but perhaps alsp how to correctly pronounce each and every letter and thus ever word, as well as many other insights into the examination of the text. I don't have any proof of this, but it seems to me that perhaps there is more in the text to uncover that would shed light on the application of the oral application of the hebrew.:)

Shalom
Offline cgb2  
#9 Posted : Tuesday, October 16, 2012 7:11:39 AM(UTC)
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I had downloaded most/all and kept them handy with "YY" on end of filename, and will repost in scripture only thread (except Paul's letters). Also repost James' Bar'esheth (Genesis) chapters 1-30, along with more recent (but probably not latest) YY/ItG compilations.
Offline cgb2  
#10 Posted : Tuesday, October 16, 2012 7:51:16 AM(UTC)
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Jason wrote:
cgb2....
do you use LOGOS original languages software? what tools should I get? BTW E-sword does not work on my MAC but I do have something similar that includes maps, lexicon and interlinear. do you have smartphone? I have I phone and use an APP called "HebrewBible" by a guy names Bill Clementson. It is actuall a really cool App, its about 10$, has maps and organizes locations with corresponding locations mentioned in each book, the the root word search is really nice too, you can search words in the root search to get past the vowel points barrier in the built in lexicon. You just touch the hebrew word on the touch screen and the definition pops up. Very kool.


Yes I have LOGOS OL, and use to verify, but still need to get my wings on translating....even desire to start with Leviticus, but currently overwhelmed with other things until winter sets in.

I often use E-Sword on the PC or My-Sword on the kindle fire for quick refs copy/paste.
With those lexicons (especially strongs) which seem to have an agenda on supporting certain bible translations (primary , secondary, etc definitions), you can still see thru their ruse by looking at word used lists ;^)
Offline Jason  
#11 Posted : Tuesday, October 16, 2012 3:37:14 PM(UTC)
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needhelp wrote:
I have the .rar files for Scripture-only-versions.



Ok great! Can I get a look at them?
Offline Jason  
#12 Posted : Tuesday, October 16, 2012 3:47:32 PM(UTC)
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cgb2 wrote:
I had downloaded most/all and kept them handy with "YY" on end of filename, and will repost in scripture only thread (except Paul's letters). Also repost James' Bar'esheth (Genesis) chapters 1-30, along with more recent (but probably not latest) YY/ItG compilations.



cgb2 that is great news! James has the first 30 chapters of baresheth?? That is great!! Wow what a great start to this project!! James, thank you for sharing your diligent efforts with this forum. I can't wait to read them.

Offline Jason  
#13 Posted : Wednesday, October 17, 2012 7:02:46 PM(UTC)
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cgb2 and James, I have not yet been able to track down any working amplification posts in the forum. I did not see any working post of scriptures amplified in the scripture only thread yet. cgb2, can you email them to me?(prefer PDF in on a MAC) both James's baresheth chapters and also the YY amplifications if and when you get a chance. thanks
Offline needhelp  
#14 Posted : Thursday, October 18, 2012 1:37:07 AM(UTC)
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How do you post a zip file or pdf?
Offline cgb2  
#15 Posted : Thursday, October 18, 2012 1:46:08 AM(UTC)
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Jason wrote:
cgb2 and James, I have not yet been able to track down any working amplification posts in the forum. I did not see any working post of scriptures amplified in the scripture only thread yet. cgb2, can you email them to me?(prefer PDF in on a MAC) both James's baresheth chapters and also the YY amplifications if and when you get a chance. thanks


Seems to be many download counts:
http://forum.yadayahweh....ipture-Only-Version.aspx

Not sure how you find recent posts. I often use Active Topics > last day, last 2 days, etc
Offline Jason  
#16 Posted : Thursday, October 18, 2012 7:55:39 AM(UTC)
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Ok I got them. Thanks so much, all of you for getting these into my hands and for all the work done to make these available.
Offline Steve in PA  
#17 Posted : Thursday, October 18, 2012 9:35:53 AM(UTC)
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Hi Jason-
I've heard you call in and discuss this with Yada... I've heard Yada's response to you as I have heard his response to the same question in the past. I do respect his approach in that he seems to translate and amplify Scripture in what may seem a random way but it is relevant to what he is observing and it works quite well as he is basing any insights and his commentary on what Yah is showing him through His Dabar.
I have a question for you... how do you define "this project"... ? I agree it would be awesome to have all of the TPP translated and amplified in the same format as it is presented in YY and ITG...
You're not thinking along the lines of... translate, amplify the whole of the Tanach and then publish, print and sell it are you?
Offline Jason  
#18 Posted : Friday, October 19, 2012 7:31:53 AM(UTC)
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eh steve wrote:

You're not thinking along the lines of... translate, amplify the whole of the Tanach and then publish, print and sell it are you?




No. I do not want to publish and/or sell any part of the project. I used the word "publish" in my first post errantly, I was just trying do describe putting it up online or making a finished product available in one way or another. I would like it to be available for free online and I'm not interested in any copyright or anything like that. Regarding printing however, if there is some way the option was there for those who want a hard copy, maybe later something could be arranged where it could be printed and shipped, of course this would cost something but just the price of printing and shipping. I don't want any part of selling it myself. Maybe it would be better just left online where people could print it out for themselves. I think I like that better.

I am going to start summarizing a point form description of what I have in mind for the online amplification of the entire TP&P and get feedback from others. I would like to mention that I am very inadequate for this task and that I can use all the help I can get. I haven't even got good research tools yet and there is still my time constraints too. Also, I'm not a very proficient computer guy either so this is going to be a really exiting learning experience for me and it will probably take some time to do. However I did not expect to have such fantastic contributions so soon either. I want to make it clear too that I don't consider this my project really, I just saw a need and I'm trying to help make it happen for myself and others also. I'm open to feedback all the way through this process.

Offline Steve in PA  
#19 Posted : Friday, October 19, 2012 8:40:38 AM(UTC)
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Thanks for the clarification Jason.
Offline Yah Tselem  
#20 Posted : Friday, October 19, 2012 12:53:54 PM(UTC)
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I'm already working on Shemowth (Exodus) but I haven't gotten very far - only several verses.. I also started making a list of all the Hebrew Words and their meanings. It may have already been mentioned, but I(we) have all of the 'Scripture only' portions of Yada Yah & ITG on PDF, so we really just need to fill in the blanks.. Just getting the first 4 books done would be a GINORMOUS accomplishment.. Also, I don't use Yada's exact style of amplifying.. I add the Hebrew words written in Paleo. Also, it would be best to have 2 versions: one that is amplified and one that still has the Hebrew word in parenthesis but not the alternate meanings of each word... my 2 cents..
And Jason if you're on FB, come join our group..
Offline cgb2  
#21 Posted : Friday, October 19, 2012 3:44:40 PM(UTC)
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Jason wrote:
.... Regarding printing however, if there is some way the option was there for those who want a hard copy, maybe later something could be arranged where it could be printed and shipped, of course this would cost something but just the price of printing and shipping.....


One can always take PDFs (probalby MSWord too) down to Kinkos, UPS store, etc - get it printed double sided, punched and bound into book form too.
Do B&W though since color is like 4x the cost per page.
Offline Jason  
#22 Posted : Sunday, October 21, 2012 6:21:28 AM(UTC)
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Yah Tselem wrote:
I'm already working on Shemowth (Exodus) but I haven't gotten very far - only several verses.. I also started making a list of all the Hebrew Words and their meanings. It may have already been mentioned, but I(we) have all of the 'Scripture only' portions of Yada Yah & ITG on PDF, so we really just need to fill in the blanks.. Just getting the first 4 books done would be a GINORMOUS accomplishment.. Also, I don't use Yada's exact style of amplifying.. I add the Hebrew words written in Paleo. Also, it would be best to have 2 versions: one that is amplified and one that still has the Hebrew word in parenthesis but not the alternate meanings of each word... my 2 cents..
And Jason if you're on FB, come join our group..



Great!. I hear ya in that more versions than one should be wrought. I think that there will be many phases to this project, and also many different versions and ways we can present a translation of the hebrew scriptures that can help uncover and accentuate different aspects of Yahwah's revelation. I am thinking now that I will just put up everything available as it exists today online and provide admin login info for those who want to contribute a portion and/or touch up the site as they see fit. Once we have a completed collage of vastly more accurate and less misleading english translations, then we can start moving into sub-projects where we can all do our own translations individually or collaborate in groups, using specific translation methods and styles to bring a few of the many different facets of the hebrew texts into english.

I will update as I progress.

Shalom
Offline Calliopebrook  
#23 Posted : Friday, October 26, 2012 8:18:56 PM(UTC)
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cgb2 wrote:
> How do you feel about Yahwah’s name, for the first time ever, being transliterated properly 7000 times? I would like to be part of the group that made that happen, or “holy” being completely removed from the text and replaced with set apart, for all to see and study for themselves and the religious community having absolutely no legitimate grounds to argue. This to me is a very compelling prospect.

You may want to look into ISR "The Scriptures":
http://www.isr-messianic.org/

Although still usual poor translations, at least without the offense of replacing "YHWH/Yahowsha" name, along with removing pagan terms (holy = set apart), also with hebrew names.

Another is http://www.halleluyahscriptures.com/

so good
Offline cgb2  
#24 Posted : Saturday, October 27, 2012 6:18:56 PM(UTC)
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^ I was digging around the Halleluyah scriptures website today and noted they are embarking on a audio version effort.
Already they have a split over 2 versions (and 2 versions example clips of Ruth) of whether YHWH is pronounced "Yahweh" or Yah-huw-wah. Something both ISR and HS seeked to avoid by ISR using babylonian hebrew, and HS paleohebrew for the names....and seems they haven't even considered the different pronounciations folks use for Massayah's name yet.

Hey, should we request a third version using Yahowah...naw Yahuwah sounds close enough. The narrators even have different accents, a mix of Yankee, southern, etc with slight differences on how enunciated and syllable emphasis ;^)
but I'd prefer the one that starts and ends with the ahhh sound. Now to do something about their improper renderings of shamar, shama, yare, torah, chok, mitswah, etc
Offline Jason  
#25 Posted : Friday, November 2, 2012 12:41:24 PM(UTC)
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It would be great to have a reliable translation in audio and also real great to have an audio hebrew purged of corrupting influences. I have an audio bible that I can't listen to anymore because of the use of "the lord" over and over again makes me sick, and it is hard enough being nourished from the available translations. I have the modern hebrew audio bible too but it stinks with "Adonai" replacing Yahwah's name, so it bugs me too.

These ISR and HS would at least remove two very disgusting corruptions.

I have a hunch that even some of the rules we apply to the reading of the text may be tampered with. I was at the AHRC website the other day and it seems to me that if they adopt the use of the "V" sound, what else is being applied to the interpretation of the text?

It would be great to hear Yada do a complete series on reading hebrew and teach all the mechanics of the text that he has come to understand. There is smatterings of it throughout BTR archives but its difficult to study on the mechanics of hebrew by just getting a little info every few hours of discussion on various topics.
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