Shalom,

Just listened to a Nazarene Israelite about the need to obey Yahweh's command to Israel to wear the tsit-tzit and regarding circumcision. Quoted quite a bit of Scripture supporting this need so that we can sit with Him at His table. Any comments about this?

Shalom,

Well, it's kinda hard to put a link as he was here in person talking about how much Paul was misunderstood in Galatians, Corinthians and other epistles. He said that the Jews were in error by adding to the Torah, and that the Christians failed by taking away from it. At the same time, he also noted Scripture passages that required followers of Yahweh to observe the wearing of tsit-tziyot and circumcision, saying that it is a command to all of Israel, the inheritors of the promises to Abraham of which we become as believers in Messiyah Yahushua. There is no distinction between a natural-born Israelite and a stranger who becomes an Israelite. Regarding his understanding on tsit-tziyot it is similar to that found in here at www.eliyah.com/tassels.html.

He noted that Scripture shows that all were accepted at Passover but they entered the Promised Land, all had to be circumcised to be acknowledged as part of the Family. He acknowledges the spiritual meaning of circumcision, but also contends that those who are obedient to Abba Yahweh should also be circumcised in the flesh and that is why Paul says that much benefit is to be found in circumcision of the heart AND the flesh. It is not that circumcision saves, but that it is a command unto the generations of all Israel. Yahweh saves, but then He also wants us to be obedient in many things. He quotes:

John 14:15 - If ye love me, keep my commandments.

1John 2:4 - He who says, "I know Him," and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

And these two commands about tsit-tziyot and circumcision have not been revoked. We fully understand the spiritual implications of these two commands but are there any other perspectives about this?

Well in all honesty, yes, I think that YHWH is concerned with the ox. That all creatures should partake in the fruit of their labors and benefit from their service is a principle completely in character with YHWH. It literally has to do with an ox or any other beast of burden deserving benefit and enjoyment from their labor (their wage). On the literal/practical side this commandment not only teaches kindness to animals in the broader sense but it teaches something even more obscure in the human psyche: consideration and thoughtfulness towards animals. There is one very big point that we have to keep in mind, while we live in modern technically advanced societies where this commandment in the literal sense may be obsolete....More than half the world still can live out this commandment on a daily basis. A great percentage of Subsistance farmers in Africa, Asia, and to a lesser extent South America are still "living biblically". As it goes yes, it is most certainly right that the commandment holds greater spiritual truths than the practical day to day usage, but lets not overlook the practical truths just because we feel the eternal and spiritual truths are more important. The commandments on the practical side are designed so that they provoke thought. You look at the commandment to build a fence on your roof. And you think...hey...that's antiquated...we don't have flat roofs that we use as living spaces. Once again...much of the world's population still does, but what does it mean for us? Practically, it means being responsible for and ensuring other people's safety through the use of proper precautions. We don't often see our hated neighbor's livestock fallen into a hole, but we may very well may see his car at the local diner with it's headlights on. Not only do these Torah precepts teach deeper spiritual truths, but they also teach deeper practical applicable truths. I honestly have no fear that I am improperly extrapolating.



The commandment does not have to deal with mixing any two fibers. Specifically it has to do with mixing Linen and Wool. It's not about mixing cotton and polyester or silk and radon or whatever. It says those two specific fibers. I think we can seek out matters and try to understand them and personally I feel that KP's conclusion that the commandment in a spiritual sense means not equating works and grace or mixing works and grace. But, for some of these commandments can it just be that they given as a leap of faith in the dark? Not having to understand the reason why, but just trusting that our FATHER and KING knows best? Could some of these commandments be exercises in faith that hone our sense of trust and reliance on FATHER YHWH? That is not to say YHWH is arbitrary or would command something only for that reason, but could it not serve His purposes and ours sometimes not to reveal the purposes and intents behind every commandment? I believe it to be so. Just a quick side note, there might be another reason why shatnez (linen+wool) is verboten. The mixed fabric was used in Pagan ceremonial garb. If you think about it, being that the Catholic church is the Whore of Babylon's faithful child, and in that institution we see the faith+ works gospel in perfect clarity, and we know that religious systems use manmade rules to bury and control the average man and are all the offspring of the whore...then I don't think it's so much a stretch to think that this mixing was another stench in YHWH's nose....much like boiling a kid in it's mother's milk. Now you think of that and you say to yourself...hey...wait...how are we supposed to know that...and what pagan connection is there today to these obscure, seemingly inconsequential acts? Think about that? Those that are sincere...those that do search...come to the knowledge of these things....and in that knowledge we realize the seething hatred that YHWH has towards every aspect of false religion and false gods. These things make us examine our own lives...what is our shatnez? What is our boiled kid in the here and now? I don't think it's a stretch.

Shalom

Great post shalom! I sometimes get so caught up with the spiritual side that I don't consider the practical side, the simplicity of caring for one's own creatures. I take comfort in your words and am always open for correction, in terms of a little straightening out. I am by no means offended by any brother in Yahushua. I didn't take notice when I posted my message but only after reading your reply did I search for more passages related to the topic. I came across Leviticus 19:19 "Keep my decrees. Do not mate different kinds of animals. Do not plant your field with two kinds of seed. Do not wear clothing woven of two kinds of material." When I first started looking towards Torah this was one passage that got me, because I actually started to look at all my clothes, I hadn't come across TOM then, so it was a bit worrisome for me, I felt as is my sin was skyhigh because I knew some of my items were mixed, being cotton and polyester. I take preference to the spiritual side, but I still consider the literal side. I also now prefer wearing tshirts without logos, relegating my Liverpool football shirt to the bottom of the draw.


On the count of three, raise your hands if you are circumcised! One...two...three!

Aye!

Not my choice, but when I was a little tott! Not that my parents were following Torah in any way either. But it was common practice then. Now with my son?! I wanted him to be on the 8th day, but my wife's family stood against me, even when they are a mix of Jews and Catholics themselves. As for New Moon's? It's one thing I would like to do, I am considering it, at the moment I use the dates KP has posted. I think going out every month to see the moon is a beautiful way for us to remember Yah's awesomeness, a gentle reminder that He's our Timekeeper, that He is our Elohim and Father. As for Taruwah, KP goes into the history of it, they call it the "hidden day" because "no one knows the day" on which it will fall even though there's only the possibility of it being on one day or the next.