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Offline Robskiwarrior  
#1 Posted : Tuesday, July 14, 2009 11:29:54 PM(UTC)
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I kept hearing about this "Gesus" god of the druids, and I could never find anything on him, so I emailed in and this is the response I got.


Quote:

Rob,

I first came upon the reference in Brett Stortroen's Mecca and Muhammad. He wrote one of the best researched books on the origin of Allah using many of the same sources I had used. His expertise in in pagan names. In his preface, he wrote about how the Masoretes corrupted Yahushua to Yeshu by way of their arbitrary vowel pointing in the 11th century. He did a nice job of affirming Yahushua, rather than Jesus. Then he went on to write: "The Bishop Bible, the Great Bible, the original KJAV of 1611 does not have the name Jesus nor in any of the earlier English language translations can Jesus be found transliterated. The earliest reference to the phonetic sound roots back to the paganistic roots that stemmed forth from the Druids and Celtics who worshipped the "Horned One," taught in their Trinitarian tenet that had a "Saviour" called phonetically GESUS. Even though the name was altered in the 1700s to Jesus, many individuals were and are being saved using this generic name. However the truth deserves a verdict, and not the vain excuses and teachings of manmade traditions of Christianity. Praise be to Yahshua the only true H'Shem and Saviour, Yahweh."

If you have a copy of C.J. Koster's Come Out of Her My People, in pages 62-65 he does a great job of linking Iesous with the Greek goddess of healing Ieso. In retrospect, I sould have cited it because it's not only compelling, I found three other resources which made the same connections in addition to the three he cited.

While searching, I stumbled upon the following, much of which I found affirmed elsewhere: http://www.yahweh.com/SAVIOR/search.htm

The First Council of Nicaea and the "missing records"
Up until the First Council of Nicaea, the Roman aristocracy primarily worshipped two Greek gods_Apollo and Zeus_but the great bulk of common people idolised either Julius Caesar or Mithras (The Romanised version of the Persian deity Mithra). Caesar was deified by the Roman Senate after his death (15 March 44 bc) and subsequently venerated as "the Divine Julius". The word "Saviour" was affixed to his name, its literal meaning being "one who sows the seed", i.e., he was a phallic god. Julius Caesar was hailed as "God made manifest and universal Saviour of human life", and his successor Augustus was called the "ancestral God and Saviour of the whole human race" (Man and his Gods, Homer Smith, Little, Brown & Co., Boston, 1952). Emperor Nero (54-68), whose original name was Lucius Domitius Ahenobarbus (37-68), was immortalised on his coins as the "Saviour of mankind" (ibid.). The Divine Julius as Roman Saviour and "Father of the Empire" was considered "God" among the Roman rabble for more than 300 years. He was the deity in some Western presbyters' texts, but was not recognised in Eastern or Oriental writings.
Constantine's intention at Nicaea was to create an entirely new god for his empire who would unite all religious factions under one deity. Presbyters were asked to debate and decide who their new god would be. Delegates argued among themselves, expressing personal motive for inclusion of particular writings that promoted the finer traits of their own special deity. Throughout the meeting, howling factions were immersed in heated debates, and the names of 53 gods were tabled for discussion. "As yet, no God had been selected by the council, and so they balloted in order to determine that matter... For one year and five months the balloting lasted..." (God's Book of Eskra, Prof. S.L. MacGuire's translation, Salisbury, 1922, chapter xlviii, paragraphs 36, 41).
At the end of that time, Constantine returned to the gathering to discover that the presbyters had not agreed on a new deity but had balloted down to a short list of five prospects: Caesar, Krishna, Mithra, Horus and Zeus (Historia Ecclesiastica, Eusebius, c. 325). Constantine was the ruling spirit at Nicaea and he ultimately decided upon a new god for them. To involve British factions, he ruled that the name of the Druid god, Hesus, be joined with the Eastern Saviour-god, Krishna (Krishna is Sanskrit for Christ), and thus Hesus Krishna would be the official name of the new Roman god. A vote was taken and it was with a majority show of hands (161 votes to 157) that both divinities become one God. Following long-standing heathen custom, Constantine used the official gathering and the Roman apotheosis decree to legally deify two deities as one, and did so by democratic consent. A new god was proclaimed and "officially" ratified by Constantine (Acta Concilii Nicaeni, 1618). That purely political act of deification effectively and legally placed Hesus and Krishna among the Roman gods as one individual composite. That abstraction lent Earthly existence to amalgamated doctrines of the Empire's new religion; and because there was no letter "J" in alphabets until around the ninth century, the name subsequently evolved into "Jesus Christ".
Nexus Magazine, Volume 14, Number 4

On this site: http://www.sacrednamemov...m/InvitationEssayC.html, you will find:

The Druid god ESUS is pronounced EE -SOOCE > > ?-PIG!
the Druid god ESUS also called HESUS pronounced He or HEY-SOOCE HEY -PIG!

Followed by:

SO HOW DID THIS GOD "ESUS" OR "HESUS" FIND IT'S WAY INTO CHURCHES? "THE CELTIC people of Gaul and Britain,south of Hadrian's wall,were conquered by the romans,and in Britain the Roman rule lasted for over 4 centuries.

The Roman conquest produced in Gaul and Britain a real assimilation to all that was Roman. The Celts especially in Gaul(old France),had many deities,... Over three hundred names of such local deities are known to have existed,most of these in Gaul,some in Britain. Hence Caesar could speak of the Gauls as worshipping Mercury,Apollo, Mars,Jupiter,Dis, and Minerva.

As time went on,and as the Celts submitted to Roman civilization, they accepted these equations. They allowed or even encouraged the Romanizing of their RELIGION as far as the deities and worship were concrned. Inded,in their growing desire for oneness with Rome,the Gauls tried hard to find as many links as possible,however slight,between their deities and those of Rome.

(CELTIC SCOTLAND page 24) "Esus" - A Gaulish god,prob.originally a god of vegetation. He is equated with Mars or sometimes Mercury. (WEBSTER'S NEW 20TH CENTURY DICTIONARY)

The Norse "Odinn",who on account of his ritual hanging of himself,is sometimes called God of the Rope or The Hanged. This would seem to gave him kinship with "ESUS" in whose honor sacrificial victims were hanged and,(hung in trees), in addition, there is an equation often made between "Odinn" and "Mercury".
(THE DRUIDS & THEIR HERITAGE) page 97

How does HESUS or ESUS tie in with Zeus? According to BULFINCHES MYTHOLOGY, The Roman equivalent to "ODIN" is "JUPTER". Everyone knows that the Roman "JUPITER" is equivlent to the Greek "ZEUS".

There are also the phonetics to consider that are involved in the suffix of the names of ESUS or HESUS and IESUS (jesus) and the parallels of the phonetics in the name "ZEUS". Where there had been many gods men came to think there must be really only one god under a diverity of names. He had been everywhere- under an alias. The Roman "JUPITER", the Greek "ZEUS",the Babylonian"BEL-MARDUK,the Egyptian "AMMON and RA",Ammon ,who was the putative father of Alexander the old antagonist of Amenophis IV . Where there were distinct differences,the difficulty was met by saying that these were DIFFERENT ASPECTS OF THE SAME GOD. (THE OUTLINE OF HISTORY) VOL 1 page 323 Masonry knows what so many forget,THAT RELIGIONS ARE MANY, BUT RELIGION IS ONE. Therefore it invites to it's altar men of all faiths,knowing that,if they use different names for THE NAMELESS ONE OF A HUNDRED NAMES, they are yet praying to ONE GOD and father of all. ( A quote from beneath the cover of the bible that sits on the altar in >the Masonic lodge as the interductory section) RELIGION Something for ya'll to think about! You will not find the word "religion" in the Hebrew Scriptures. It's not found in the OT. If you go to the Strong's and look up this word, It gives two # for this word in five places #2356 and #2454 Greek dic. Only from the Greek translations is this word to be found and translated into English as "RELIGION". Three places in the Greek NT,in Acts.26:5, Jas.1:26,27, it's Strong's # 2356-"THRESKEIA" from a der.of 2357;ceremonial observance: religion,worshipping. Two places in the Greek NT in Gal.1:13,14, it's Strong's #2454 "IOUDAISMOS" from 2450:JUDAism,i.e. the JEWish faith and useages---JEWS RELIGION. The question this all raises in my mind, is do you have a "THRESKEIA" or a "IOUDAISMOS" (RELIGION) in your life ? As far as Hebrew goes,I don't see "RELIGION"! There is NO WORD in Hebrew for it. Doesn't this mean in Hebrew there is no such thing as "RELIGION"? So where does that leave CHRISTianity and JUDAism? Are these not "RELIGIONS"? One being "THRESKIA" ,the other being "IOUDAISMOS" = both being what we call in English "RELIGIONs"!? Is this thing called "RELIGION",an invention of mans hands in this case the invention of Greek hands or is it much older than the Greeks? Clearly the Masons Believe in RELIGION!

But that being as it may,back to the main subject at hand. ESUS and HESUS and IESUS (jesus)are so close in pronouncation phoneticlly it's real hard to miss. ESUS----ee-sooce . HESUS--he or hey-sooce. IESUS---ee-sooce. JESUS---gee-sooce> > and guess what not one of them mean SAVE or SAVIOR! THE SUFFIX OF THE SURROGATE NAMES OF THE SAVIOR We are told that the Messiah's Name in Greek is "Ie-sous" pronounced ee-ay -sooce. In Latin it's written "Ie-svs" or "Ie-sus" pronounced ee-/sooce or zus In Old English it is written also "Ie-svs" or "Ie-sus" pronounced ee-/sooce or zus In the last two hundred years this name has evolved (because of the (J) factor) to "Je-sus" pronounced Gee-/sooce or zus THESE ARE ALL CONSIDERED TO BE WHAT IS CALLED TRANSLITERATIONS! This is the means of bringing across the letters and sounds of letters from one language to another.
Unquestionably there are phonetic parallels between the sound of the name "Zeus" and the sound of the suffix of the Latin "Ie-SUS" and the English "Ie-SUS"& "Je-SUS" which are both pronounced "SOOCE" or "ZUS" in English, and this is certainly a factor to consider and keep in mind. But this is not the direction of this topic today. What I want to address is this. If you go to your dictionary and look up the word/name "SWINE" you find that in Latin the word/name SWINE is "SUS".

The following site confirms the names of the Druid gods: http://books.google.com/...p;ct=result&resnum=8

"The druidic god was a carpenter named Yesu/Esus/Hesus, long prior to the Christian era." It also says: The druidic trinity was composed of three Beli (Baal, Bal, or Bel). Interestingly, Yesu, also Hesus, was the name of the Druid "Coming Savoiur of the future." Capt then naively remarks, "Druidism thus anticipated Christianity and pointed to the coming Saviour under the very name by which Christ was called."

On this site http://www.newagepointof...y.com/NAU/16saviors.htm, Hesus of the Druids, is listed as a savior who died and rose.

This site http://books.google.com/...;ct=result&resnum=1, says "And in Britain an echo of the Druidic name for the coming Saviour, Yesu, survives in the name Jesu, Used in to of the ancient hymns."

On this site http://www.mosqueonline..../the-bible/borrowed.htm, "Krishna was depicted as if crucified. The persian remembered only the atoning sufferings on the cross of Mithras the Mediator." Also:

Tammuz was a god of Assyria, Babylonia and Sumeria where he was known as Dumuzi. He is commemorated in the name of the month of June, Du'uzu, the fourth month of a year which begins at the spring equinox. The fullest history extant of this saviour is probably that of Ctesias (400 BC), author of Persika. The poet has perpetuated his memory in rhyme.

Trust, ye saints, your Lord restored,
Trust ye in your risen Lord;
For the pains which Tammuz endured
Our salvation have procured.

Tammuz was crucified as an atonement offering: Trust ye in God, for out of his loins salvation has come unto us. Julius Firmicus speaks of this God rising from the dead for the salvation of the world. This saviour which long preceded the advent of Christ, filled the same role in sacred history.

And then:

Hesus of the Celtic Druids 834 BC.

The Celtic Druids depict their god Hesus as having been crucified with a lamb on one side and an elephant on the other, and that this occurred long before the Christian era.

The elephant, being the largest animal known, was chosen to represent the magnitude of the sins of the world, while the lamb, from its proverbial innocent nature, was chosen to represent the innocence of the victim, the god offered as a propitiatory sacrifice. We have the Lamb of God taking away the sins of the world. The Lamb of God could therefore have been borrowed from the Druids. This legend was found in Gaul long before Jesus Christ was known to history.


This site http://books.google.com/...p;ct=result&resnum=5 , on page 393, affirms all of the same things about the Druid Yesu



not sure who replied - but thanks! :)

EDIT: found this completly randomly!!!

UserPostedImage

Edited by user Wednesday, July 15, 2009 1:51:04 AM(UTC)  | Reason: added image

Signature Updated! Woo that was old...
Offline James  
#2 Posted : Wednesday, July 15, 2009 3:06:07 AM(UTC)
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It sounds like a Yada response to me. Very incitefull, I have read the Come Out of Her My People breakdown of Jesus and relating it back to Greek Gods, it is very incitefull, and interesting. I think I shall have to read Brett Stortroen's Mecca and Muhammad. Thanks for sharing Rob.
Don't take my word for it, Look it up.

“The truth is not for all men but only for those who seek it.” ― Ayn Rand
Offline Robskiwarrior  
#3 Posted : Wednesday, July 15, 2009 4:19:10 AM(UTC)
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Yea it was I got this back from him again...

Quote:

Rob,

Having gone through the material again, my conclusion was that the name of the Druid Savior was Hesus, but that this was changed to Gesus and then Jesus a 100 years or so before the KJV first used Jesus in 1629. Also, rather than being the Horned One, the primary deity of the Druids, Hesus was similar to Nimrod, Tammuz, Bachcus, Isis, Adonis, etc.

The most interesting material is related to changing the Yahushua placeholders to become the masculine version of the Greek goddess of healing. And I found the Masoretic vowel pointing explanation of Yeh, versus Yahushua interesting.
Signature Updated! Woo that was old...
Offline lassie1865  
#4 Posted : Thursday, July 16, 2009 5:46:38 AM(UTC)
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Rob,

I referenced the yahweh.com/Savior website. It really sounded like a JW site; they are trying to say that Yahushua was created, was not divine, "logos" means "plan", etc. What am I missing here?

Lassie1865
Offline James  
#5 Posted : Thursday, July 16, 2009 6:01:39 AM(UTC)
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I like how Yada put it one day on the show when talking about Bruce Metzger's book, he has come to many errant understandings, but his research is sound and worth reading, it's like many PHDs they do great research, but come to bad conclusions based on there preconceived notions.

The yahweh.com site has many errant ideas, but their research at least in this department seems to be sound, and should be read and understood.
Don't take my word for it, Look it up.

“The truth is not for all men but only for those who seek it.” ― Ayn Rand
Offline Matthew  
#6 Posted : Thursday, July 16, 2009 10:13:31 AM(UTC)
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James wrote:
I like how Yada put it one day on the show when talking about Bruce Metzger's book, he has come to many errant understandings, but his research is sound and worth reading, it's like many PHDs they do great research, but come to bad conclusions based on there preconceived notions.

The yahweh.com site has many errant ideas, but their research at least in this department seems to be sound, and should be read and understood.


On one of the first radio recordings, on the episode discussing the veracity of the English Bible translations, Yada references Bart Ehrman and his book called Misquoting Jesus in that Bart does great work in understanding the history of Biblical translations. However, this Mr Ehrman guy also comes to some seriously errant conclusions though, as he's a leading author in favour of Atheism. I doubt Mr Ehrman would write what he does if he understood the Torah and Prophets the way Yada and KP do.

Thanks for posting Yada's response Rob, it's a great email.
Offline Nakaryah  
#7 Posted : Tuesday, July 13, 2010 10:42:55 AM(UTC)
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James wrote:
It sounds like a Yada response to me. Very incitefull, I have read the Come Out of Her My People breakdown of Jesus and relating it back to Greek Gods, it is very incitefull, and interesting. I think I shall have to read Brett Stortroen's Mecca and Muhammad. Thanks for sharing Rob.



Here is a quote from Dictionary of Christian Lore and Legend By J. C. J. Metford:

"It is known that the Greek name endings of sus, seus, and sous (which are phonetic pronunciations for Zeus) were attached by the Greeks to names and geographical areas as a means to give honor to their supreme deity, Zeus. Examples given are: Parnassus, a sacred mountain in Greece: the Greek deity of wine and son of Zeus, Dionysus; the Greek hero of the Trojan war was Odysseus, and the Greek deity of healing was Iesous or the Latin Iesus/Jesus. They also changed the names of the prophets EliYahu (whose name means 'my mighty one is Yah') and Elyesha (whose name means 'my mighty one saves'), to 'Elias' and 'Eliseus' (which means 'my mighty one is Zeus'). This was done so often that it later was the basis for their rules of written grammar which followed the common or vernacular spoken language."
Offline cgb2  
#8 Posted : Friday, August 26, 2011 2:43:17 AM(UTC)
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I found some links in wiki regarding Druid god Hesus/Esus/Aisus ...the likely origin of "Jesus"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esus

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Druid
Offline ks77  
#9 Posted : Wednesday, August 31, 2011 3:08:12 AM(UTC)
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I remember reading that a while ago and being confused over: "Modern scholars consider the resemblance between the names Esus and Jesus to be coincidental." Either scholars have no idea or this is the biggest coincidence in history?

If it's one thing I learned at uni this semseter, it's my 'Old Testament' teacher telling us how scholars most of the time are just guessing. And they have to come up with something new and different that challenges the view of the last scholar, otherwise it's plagerism and no one's really interested if it's the same thing, even if it is most likely to be true. So in a few years, another scholar is going to come out refuting the previous and the cycle repeats.
Offline FredSnell  
#10 Posted : Wednesday, August 31, 2011 3:28:39 AM(UTC)
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ks77 wrote:
If it's one thing I learned at uni this semseter, it's my 'Old Testament' teacher telling us how scholars most of the time are just guessing.


I find the word, "guessing" a coincidence, with esus and jesus...lol
Offline Chrestucian  
#11 Posted : Friday, September 2, 2011 5:51:42 AM(UTC)
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By my research the name is obviously a reference to the Greek rapper, Jay-Zeus.

EDIT: Please note that when my statements begin with "By my research..." it generally means I'm just making something up. By my research that's the best way to enter the research field.
Offline Daniel  
#12 Posted : Monday, September 5, 2011 2:41:46 AM(UTC)
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Chrestucian wrote:
By my research the name is obviously a reference to the Greek rapper, Jay-Zeus.

EDIT: Please note that when my statements begin with "By my research..." it generally means I'm just making something up. By my research that's the best way to enter the research field.


96.5% of all statistics are made up on the spot.
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"We carried our weapons with us at all times, even when we went for water" Nehemiah 4:23b

We would do well to follow Nehemiah's example! http://OurSafeHome.net
Offline James  
#13 Posted : Monday, September 5, 2011 3:37:39 AM(UTC)
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Daniel wrote:
96.5% of all statistics are made up on the spot.


A recent study has shown that in election cycles that number has increases to 99.2%
Don't take my word for it, Look it up.

“The truth is not for all men but only for those who seek it.” ― Ayn Rand
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