They are 2 seperate entities and have never included the Holy Spirit. Yashua is NOT the Father and the Father is not Yashua.

(to be posted Saturday. Enough for one sitting)

are you a JW? lol Godhead is a word that was made up and inserted into scripture as well btw...

There are several things going on here:

1. What does the word Yahweh mean?
2. Are the Father and Son separate or one?

I want to address the word Yahweh (Jehovah) first. Then in part 2 I want to address how they can be separate. If the Father and Son are the same entity with just a different name then you could easily say that the Father morphs into a “set-apart” spirit too. But where does it stop? You could say the Father morphed into a rock, and into an animal, and into human. What I am suggesting is that the Father is the Father, the Son is the Son, the Holy Spirit is its own entity (entities), man is a creation, angels are a creation, etc. There is protocol in how things were set up. The Father is not morphing and changing shape (in fact we are told he has no shape).

Part 1 – What is his name?

We are told that Jehovah made all things…

Isa 45:11 So says Jehovah, the Holy One of Israel, and the One who formed him, Do you ask Me of the things to come? Do you give command to Me about My sons, and about the work of My hands?
Isa 45:12 I have made the earth, and created man on it. I stretched out the heavens with My hands; and I have set all their host in order.

And in Job we read………………………

Job 38:1 And Jehovah answered Job out of the tempest and said:
Job 38:2 Who is this that darkens counsel by words without knowledge?
Job 38:3 Now gird up your loins like a man, for I will question you; and you teach Me.
Job 38:4 Where were you when I founded the earth? Declare if you know understanding.

Yet in Hebrews we read this…

Heb 1:1 In the past God spoke to our ancestors at many different times and in many different ways through the prophets.
Heb 1:2 In these last days he has spoken to us through his Son. God made his Son responsible for everything. His Son is the one through whom God made the universe.

In Hebrews we are told that the Son made the universe and if that is true then He is the same thing as Jehovah. So many deduce that the son is Jehovah.

And here are more scriptural comparisons of the Son as Jehovah (pardoning the words Jesus)…

Jehovah is our shepherd - Psalm 23:1; Isaiah 40:11
Jesus is our shepherd - John 10:11

Jehovah is the I AM - Exodus 3:14 Jehovah (Yahweh) means "He Is."
Jesus Christ is the I AM - John 8:58, Revelation 1:8

Jehovah is our creator - Isaiah 44:24
Jesus Christ is our creator - John 1:3, Colossians 1:16

Jehovah is our redeemer - Jeremiah 1:34, Isaiah 47:4
Jesus Christ is our redeemer - Galatians 3:13; Revelation 5:9; Titus 2:14; Luke 24:21

Jehovah is our savior - Isaiah 43:3,10; 45:21,22; 60:16; 49:26
Jesus is our savior - 1 John 4; Luke 2:11; 2 Timothy 1; Titus 2:13; 2 Peter 1:1

Jehovah is our creator - Isaiah 44:24
Jesus Christ is our creator - John 1:3, Colossians 1:16

The implications are clear. Yashua is/was Jehovah. But he never had the name Yashua until he was begotten. Before he was begotten as Yashua he was Jehovah/Yahweh/YHVH. And we know the Father to be Jehovah. Does that mean they are one and the same? What about the word “El”, “Elohim”, and “Eloah”? What IS the name of “God”? Lest look at the words El and Elohim…

Elohim

Elohim occurs 2,700 times. Its first occurrence connects it with creation, and give it its essential meaning as the Creator. It indicates His relation to mankind and His creatures. It also indicates the plural of the word Eloah and denotes more than one entity. We see the word used immediately in Scriptures:

Gen 1:1 In the beginning Elohim created the heavens and the earth.
Gen 1:2 And the earth came to be formless and empty, and darkness was on the face of the deep. And the Spirit of Elohim was moving on the face of the waters.

This tells us that a plurality – Elohim – created the heavens and the earth. These Scriptures read thusly in the King James Bible:

Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
Gen 1:2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

El

EL is Elohim in all His strength and power and omnipotence. For example…

Gen 14:18 And Malkitsedeq sovereign of Shalĕm brought out bread and wine. Now he was the priest of the Most High Ěl.
Gen 14:19 And he blessed him and said, “Blessed be Abram of the Most High Ěl, Possessor of the heavens and earth.
Gen 14:20 “And blessed be the Most High Ěl who has delivered your enemies into your hand.” And he gave him a tenth of all.

Gen 17:1 And it came to be when Abram was ninety-nine years old, that יהוה appeared to Abram and said to him, “I am Ěl Shaddai – walk before Me and be perfect.

This is the same verse from the King James Bible for comparison:

Gen 17:1 And when Abram was ninety years old and nine, the LORD appeared to Abram, and said unto him, I am the Almighty God; walk before me, and be thou perfect.

El and Elohim together

Here we see a combination of the words El and Elohim used together.

Gen 35:11 And Elohim said to him, “I am Ěl Shaddai. Bear fruit and increase, a nation and a company of nations shall be from you, and sovereigns come from your body.

This is the same verse from the King James Bible for comparison:

Gen 35:11 And God said unto him, I am God Almighty: be fruitful and multiply; a nation and a company of nations shall be of thee, and kings shall come out of thy loins;

As we see the intent of the word El and Elohim is very explicit in Scripture. Here are other Scriptures that support this:

Psa 22:1 My Ěl, My Ěl, why have You forsaken Me – Far from saving Me, far from the words of My groaning?

Job 4:9 Through the breath of Eloah they perish, and through the Spirit of His nostrils they are consumed.

Jehovah

While Elohim is God as the Creator of all things, Jehovah is the same God in covenant relation to those whom He has created. The Divine definition is given in Gen. 21:33. He is especially, therefore, the God of Israel; and the God of those who are redeemed, and are thus now "in Christ". Here is a comparison of how different Bibles interpret this verse:

Gen 21:33

(NIV) Abraham planted a tamarisk tree at Beersheba and worshiped the LORD, the Everlasting God, there.

(The Scriptures '98+) And he planted a tamarisk tree in Be’ĕrsheba, and there called on the Name of יהוה (Jehovah), the Everlasting Ěl.

The meaning of all this comes into play in an interesting example. We elect a president to run our country. The president has a personal name and has titles. He is our president in his relationship to us, but he is Barrack to his wife. God is basically El, Eloah, or Elohim as the name God. The term Jehovah is the Elohim in his duty or job to us - as our president so to speak. Therefore the term Jehovah is simply a Title and refers to the many aspects of what Elohim does for us as Jehovah. El can do these chores as Jehovah and so can Elohim (the plurality). His name is El, Elohim, or Eloah and He works for us as Jehovah. His name Jehovah is describing him in his work mode in relationship to us as provider and more. Actually the name Jehovah is combined with ten other words, which form what are known as "the Jehovah Titles." in the Hebrew Canon -

1. JEHOVAH-JIREH = Jehovah will see, or provide. Gen. 22:14.
2. JEHOVAH-ROPHEKA = Jehovah that healeth thee. Ex. 15:26.
3. JEHOVAH-NISSI = Jehovah my banner. Ex. 17:15.
4. JEHOVAH-MeKADDISHKEM = Jehovah that doth sanctify you. Ex. 31:13. Lev. 20:8; 21:8; 22:32. Ezek. 20:12.
5. JEHOVAH-SHALOM = Jehovah [send] peace. Judg. 6:24.
6. JEHOVAH-ZeBA'OTH = Jehovah of hosts. 1Sam. 1:3, and frequently.
7. JEHOVAH-ZIDKENU = Jehovah our righteousness. Jer. 23:6; 33:16.
8. JEHOVAH-SHAMMAH = Jehovah is there. Ezek. 48:35.
9. JEHOVAH-ELYON = Jehovah most high. Ps. 7:17; 47:2; 97:9.
10. JEHOVAH-RO'I = Jehovah my Shepherd. Ps. 23:1.

After it was decided that the Son should come into the flesh he is now known to us in duty as Yashua. In the end times he will come to us in another title that no one knows yet. When we see the word Jehovah as we see it used commonplace people are making the mistake of calling it the Father only. It is the Father through the Son in relationship to man as his duty.

Lets take this a step deeper

Of the many names or titles ascribed to God, the English-speaking world is probably most familiar with the name Lord God. We see it capitalized two different ways in literal translations of the Bible such as the KJV--Lord GOD and LORD God. This is a very significant difference.

The first Hebrew word having a bearing on these names is again in Genesis 1:1 where God introduces Himself by the Hebrew word, Elohim. The word, so intriguing because of its plural nature, surely speaks of God’s power but leaves much to be known of His nature. Consequently, it must give way to the specific name by which He has chosen to be known. We find it first mentioned in Genesis 2:4 by two Hebrew words, Jehovah and Elohim, that when coupled together are translated as LORD God in our Bibles:

Gen 2:4 These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens.

It is next used in Exodus 3:15 where the Angel of the Lord in the burning bush told Moses:

Ex 3:15 Thus you shall say to the children of Israel: ‘The LORD God of your fathers, the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob, has sent me to you. This is My name forever, and this is My memorial to all generations.’

Another Hebrew word coupling also will come to light—Adonai Jehovah, also translated Lord GOD. Do you see the difference between the two? The capitalization of the two is different. In the scores of listings of Lord God, this distinction in capitalization never varies. Since, when translated into English from the two different Hebrew word couplings, they both read as Lord God, the only means to distinguish between them was by different capitalization. If your Bible is a literal translation, KJV, NASV, RSV, etc., you will see the different capitalization throughout the Old Testament—LORD God and Lord GOD. Bear this distinction in mind; it is most crucial—LORD God (Jehovah Elohim) and Lord GOD (Adonai Jehovah).

Examine the verses where the two are used. For example, notice the context of Isaiah 61:1, 2a: “The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon Me, Because the LORD has anointed Me To preach good tidings to the poor; He has sent Me to heal the brokenhearted, To proclaim liberty to the captives, And the opening of the prison to those who are bound; To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD…”

Here are the very words Jesus used in Luke 4:1 as he initiated his ministry at Nazareth. His words, “The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me,” show us that the Lord GOD (Adonai Jehovah) must be the Father, the one true God. See similar verses in Isaiah: 28:16, 48:16, 50:4, 5, 9.

Following are just a few of many verses showing the use of LORD God to show the truth of this:

Adam and Eve, in Genesis 3:8, “heard the voice of the LORD God…and hid themselves from the presence of the LORD God.”

In Exodus 9:1, Moses, addressing the Pharaoh, says, “Thus saith the LORD God of the Hebrews, let my people go…”

In I Samuel 10:18, speaking to Israel, Samuel says, “Thus saith the LORD God of Israel, I brought up Israel out of Egypt and delivered you out of the hand of the Egyptians.”

In I Kings 18:21, Elijah asks the people, “How long halt ye between two opinions? If the LORD God be God, follow him, but if Baal, then follow him. And the people answered not a word.”

Notice in II Samuel 7:25-28 that David prays to both LORD God and Lord GOD: "Now, O LORD God, the word which You have spoken concerning Your servant and concerning his house, establish it forever and do as You have said ...Therefore Your servant has found it in his heart to pray this prayer to You. 28) "And now, O Lord GOD, You are God, and Your words are true, and You have promised this goodness to Your servant.”

(Two Gods or One God with two names?)

We see that God has ingeniously used two distinct word couplings throughout the Old Testament--Adonai Jehovah, Lord GOD, and Jehovah Elohim, LORD God. Can there be any other explanation for their use than to prophetically point to and distinguish between God the Father from His Son? With this advantage, passages, once obscure, take on new clarity. Even in the New Testament where Greek is used rather than Hebrew, references to Old Testament passages must necessarily be translated with the same meaning. Clearly, the LORD God of the Old Testament is the Son of God in the New Testament.

Jehovah obviously speaks of Deity and has already been noted, so let us focus on the meaning and significances of Elohim that follows it. Remember the use of the plural noun Elohim in Genesis 1:1? Although normally used in the singular sense, in Genesis 1:26 with regard to the creation of mankind, we read, “Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image.” What motive in this instance might God have had to refer to Himself as “US”? Might the answer be that He wanted to give a subtle clue of His union before creation with His Son? Strong’s Hebrew Dictionary defines the word Elohim as follows:

…plural of gods in the ordinary sense; but specifically used (in the plural thus, especially with the article) of the supreme God; occasionally applied by way of deference to magistrates; and sometimes as a superlative:--angels (as elohim, lower case “e”).

Linking the name Jehovah with the name Elohim provides a picture of the father in union with his Son. The words of John 14:10 come to mind:

Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father in Me? The words that I speak to you I do not speak on My own authority; but the Father who dwells in Me does the works.

To clarify even more his words, consider John 5:30, “I can of Myself do nothing. As I hear, I judge; and My judgment is righteous, because I do not seek My own will but the will of the Father who sent Me.” Jesus who was “meek and lowly” reigned supreme as he allowed the will and sufficiency of his Father to rule his life.

Our examination of names would not be complete without comparing the words Adonai and Adon. Strong’s defines Adonai as “an emphatic form of Adon; the Lord (used as a proper name of God only).” We have already seen that Adonai is used in the Hebrew word coupling referring to God. A search will show that in over 400 verses in the KJV, Adonai is always used of God whether linked with Jehovah in the word couplings or when used separately. It is never used of the Son.

With respect to Christ as Lord the word Adon is used. Adon, like the word elohim, can refer to human rulers. The definition in Strong’s shows it to be “from an unused root (meaning to rule); sovereign, i.e. controller (human or divine)—lord, master, owner.” Included in 287 verses in the KJV, it is used of Christ 28 times. But it is never used of God the Father.

Let us do a quick recap

The words Adonai Jehovah are always prophetic of the Father whether linked together or used separately.

The word coupling Jehovah Elohim always points to God’s Son. Elohim refers to the Son coupled into deity and Jehovah shows his duties to mankind.

Adonai and Adon are miles apart in their useage. Adonai always and only refers to God the Father, while Adon is used of men, even of Christ, but never of the Father.

If all this be true, and you have scripture’s word for it, does it not confirm that there are a distinct difference in the Father and the Son?

In Part 2 I want to show more in depth the separation of the Father and the Son. I also want to discuss what the word “One” means (echad – a unity).

[NOTE: In all this discussion of El, Elohim, Lord, Adonai, Jehovah, etc etc there is never a connection of any of this that refers to a Holy Spirit or Set-apart spirit. The discussion concerns whether the Son and the Father are the same entity, seperate entities, or some unique partnership. The Holy Spirit has no bearing on this relationship and is not part of this union.]

Part 2 -

In the first part I tried to point out distinction between the use of the word Jehovah in that it is not used exclusively for the Father. Since it is used for the Father and Son then we must look at what their relationship is:

1. Are they one entity with 2 faces?
2. Are they 2 unique separate entites?
3. Are they 2 entities united in a partnership?

Let me talk philosophically for a second. We have all seen a nuclear power plant. It has a source of energy in its rods. The energy sits there. There is a man that sits at a table that sends this energy downline and directs it so we can use it. Without that man the energy in the rods just sits there. What about a B-17 bomber. It is a great plane. But it just sits on the runway without a pilot. In a similar fashion there is a relationship between the Father and the son. What good is the energy of the Father unless the Son sends it and directs it?

The fact that the Father and Son are described separately, and as one, create confusion until the verses are examined closer. Here are some examples…

Isa 45:21 “Declare and bring near, let them even take counsel together. Who has announced this from of old? Who has declared it from that time? Is it not I, יהוה? And there is no mighty one besides Me, a righteous Ěl and a Saviour, there is none besides Me.

In this verse Jehovah is mentioned as a righteous “El” (God) AND a savior. We know that Yashua (Jesus) is the Savior. So the 2 are listed as “me” in that verse. But there are 2 unique entities described there. And here…

Psa 84:3 Even the sparrow has found a house, and the swallow a nest for herself, where she may lay her young, even on Your altars, O Jehovah of Hosts, my King and my God.

Jehovah of Hosts is called a King and God. This of course refers to 2 entities. Here we see a riddle where the answer is the same for the Father and the Son:

Pro 30:4 Who has gone up to Heaven, and come down? Who has gathered the wind in His fists? Who has bound the waters in His garments? Who has made all the ends of the earth to rise? What is His name, and what is His Son's name? Surely you know.

If the name implied the same word for the Father, being that the Father is really the Son too, then it would not need differentiation by calling out a Son. That would be redundant unless it refers to 2 entities.

Two as one in psalms:
Psa 2:2 The sovereigns of the earth take their stand, And the rulers take counsel together, Against יהוה and against His Messiah, and say,…..

And again, from above we note this scripture…
Psa 22:1 My Ěl, My Ěl, why have You forsaken Me – Far from saving Me, far from the words of My groaning?

If Jesus and the Father were indeed one and the same why would he use the word El here for God and why would he be talking to himself? It doesn’t make sense unless the 2 entities are in a partnership that is in unity.

Is God only one?

In Deuteronomy we read the following:

(The Scriptures '98+) “Hear, O Yisra’ĕl: יהוה our Elohim, יהוה is one!

This verse is talking about 2 different entities. The “Jehovah our Elohim”, AND “Jehovah”. The word Jehovah is not redundant since it refers to 2 different entities. As we have seen El and Elohim in this instance can be the Son or the Father as it has been used in Scripture previously. But the scripture says they are one. What does one mean?

The question can be answered by looking at the definition of the word “one” in English and in Hebrew:

A. The definition of “one” by Webster’s

According to Webster this is what one means: (moving to later definitions) -
ONE, a. wun. [L. unus; Gr.]

8. Single by union; undivided; the same.
The church is therefore one, though the members may be many.
9. Single in kind; the same.
At one, in union; in agreement or concord. In one, in union; in one united body.
It also denotes union, a united body.
Ye are all one in Christ Jesus. Gal 3.

Basically what this says is that the word “one” can mean more than one.

B. The definition of “one” by Strong’s from the Hebrew word “echad”

H259
ekh-awd'
A numeral from H258; properly united, that is, one; or (as an ordinal) first: - a, alike, alone, altogether, and, any (-thing), apiece, a certain [dai-] ly, each (one), + eleven, every, few, first, + highway, a man, once, one, only, other, some, together.

We see that some bibles use the word “one” in the following verses and some bibles use the word “united”. It all means the same thing…

Joh 17:21 that all may be one, as You are in Me, Father, and I in You, that they also may be one in Us, that the world may believe that You sent Me.
Joh 17:22 And I have given them the glory which You have given Me, that they may be one, as We are One:
Joh 17:23 I in them, and You in Me, that they may be perfected in one; and that the world may know that You sent Me and loved them, even as You loved Me.

And from this bible…

Joh 17:21 I pray that all of these people continue to have unity in the way that you, Father, are in me and I am in you. I pray that they may be united with us so that the world will believe that you have sent me.
Joh 17:22 I have given them the glory that you gave me. I did this so that they are united in the same way we are.
Joh 17:23 I am in them, and you are in me. So they are completely united. In this way the world knows that you have sent me and that you have loved them in the same way you have loved me.

(By the way he never mentions that the Holy Spirit is united with them)

The Scriptures through word definition AND through context join and combine the roles and descriptions that were separate as El and Elohim (the Father and the Son) into one interchangeable unit referred to as the Godhead. This Godhead is actually a unit – or “one” in effect, force, and intent acting in covenant as Jehovah. The truth is that God is 2, not one and not 3 as in a Trinity. The Holy Spirit is beholden to the Godhead and does its will. It is not an equal force, a part of the Father that is united only with the Son, or on any equal footing with the Father/Son Godhead.

Some last verses on the Holy Spirit

The Holy Spirit are God’s (Godhead of 2) messengers. They are Holy. The cannot fall. They have god’s name (power/authority). They are not female or male. They are not God. The Son clearly states that he is beholden to the Father in a hierarchal way and the Holy Spirit is sent from the Father or son at their direction and discretion.

Joh 14:26 However, the helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you everything. He will remind you of everything that I have ever told you.

Joh 15:26 And when the Comforter comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, the Spirit of Truth who proceeds from the Father, that One will witness concerning Me.

Again it says the “comforter” is sent FROM THE FATHER by the Son or the Father. It “proceedeth” from the Father. Here are more Scriptures on the Holy Spirit –

Heb 2:4 (LITV) God bearing witness with them by both miraculous signs and wonders, and by various works of power, even by distribution of the Holy Spirit, according to His will.

2Pe 1:21 No prophecy ever originated from humans. Instead, it was given by the Holy Spirit as humans spoke under God's direction.

The Holy Spirit is guided and is God’s messenger.

PS - seriously are you a JW? lol

I'm sorry I just found that whole thing hilarious. By digging deeper into erroneously translated words you try and dig up meaning from them, when its a waste of time. Do you actually think the name of God is Jehovah? Because even the thickest scholars know this is impossible... even the ones who say "we lost the way you pronounce it"...

dude you are so far off the money, its quite sad, your passion is awesome. Change your way of thinking, because you unfortunately are incorrect, and I don't say that to many people very often...

I hope your back is ok!

Before you ask for a proper response, read YY :) then successfully refute it, then we can have a discussion.